John Posted September 28, 2007 Report Share Posted September 28, 2007 So I go through the hassle of taking my bike apart yesterday and did the Toomey T5 pipes and silencers along with Toomey's jet kit. I was going to use the stock needles but upon re-install I accidentally dropped the throttle valve and needle assembly and bent the needle. I think the fitment of the pipes is piss poor. They are too close to the plastics and the frame. I actually can only slide maybe one piece of paper through on each side. It is also very difficult to shut the gas off without burning hands. That's beside the point. I went with the following on the bike 280 mains, Toomey needle. I have the clip in what I think is the fourth slot (do you count up from the needle point??? I did that). I also adjusted the idle air/screw to 1 1/2 turns out. I have the silencers mounted but one appears to be shorter than the other, however that was the only way to get the stingers to make a good seal and mount up. The bike fired over and warmed up nicely upon the initial ride I felt like the power be more like an on off switch. The is hardly anything and then it hauls off nicely. I am not sure if this bike is setup right, it feels faster on the pipe, but elsewhere is blows big time. Actually contemplating a different set of pipes if this is how the setup is. I didn't change the pilots which I thought was odd. I also run a 40:1 ratio of Bel-Ray H1R and Sunoco 93. Only other mods are a K&N filter and a Toomey filter which I haven't tried. After the ride today I noticed some smoke coming from the front of the bike and then I see fluid dripping down. I believe this fluid to be brake fluid upon color and smell. Is there anything I could've fucked up in the process that would cause this. I already looked under the bike and I can see this black vacuum line dripping this fluid down the frame. Any thoughts on either jetting and this mysterious leaking. I am also at sea level in Jersey. Any help is greatly appreciated, also is it worth it for me to buy new needles and put stock ones in? Thanks for any help you guys can provide me with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Jackson Posted September 28, 2007 Report Share Posted September 28, 2007 i bet you have the stinger pipes mixed up left to right, they have a small L or R stamped on the end of the stinger where it meets the flat peice that butts up against the silencer,,, toomeys are known for their great fit and finish, it shouldnt be anywhere near your petcock to burn your hand?! you must have them installed wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peak-j Posted September 28, 2007 Report Share Posted September 28, 2007 Count the grooves from the blunt end. Can you post a pic of the pipes? I installed mine just like toomey said, and mine runs great. 280 mains, stock pilots, about 1 turn out, and 32:1 Klotz. Also, I didnt' have any problem with the pipes fitting, although they were a little close to the frame under the seat. As far as the leaking, where does the hose go to? You also should do a plug chop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BellicoseBanshee Posted September 28, 2007 Report Share Posted September 28, 2007 I am sorry to hear that your pipes don't fit well, mine fit like a champ, but they are a few years old. I used Cascade pipe clamps at the joints, and they keep the joints nice and tight. The pipes do not vibrate against the frame anywhere. I also used billet hangers front and rear. The fourth groove is counted down from the blunt end. The coolant over-flow bottle hose is routed back to the front of the bike, are you sure it is not spitting coolant? I am sure you would know the difference between brake fluid and coolant, but I know that the hose end is up front (at least it was on mine). If you run the 2:1 filter, it may sit closer to the left stinger than the right one, and the outerware will touch the pipe. I use a stand of safety wire around the filter to hold the outerware in place and away from the stinger. Works great for me. Do not over oil the filter, for it will get onto the outerware and dirt/dust will stick everywhere. Good luck with the rest of the work! :thumbsup: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fastrthnu Posted September 29, 2007 Report Share Posted September 29, 2007 if you bent the toomey needle you can use a stock one. just go back to stock with both sides, 4th groove on 280 might be the recommended starting point, but chop the plugs right away anyways. I run 300 in the spring/summer and 320 in the fall/ winter Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted September 29, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 29, 2007 if you bent the toomey needle you can use a stock one. just go back to stock with both sides, 4th groove on 280 might be the recommended starting point, but chop the plugs right away anyways. I run 300 in the spring/summer and 320 in the fall/ winter The Toomey needles are supposed to be the culprits in a lot of mid throttle issues, so I have new stock needles coming and I know for a fact I have the clips in the wrong position. I also am waiting on my TORS kit and cascade clamps and hangers. I am going to take everything apart again, because this is unacceptable to me. One pipe is so close to the fuel valve it's very hard to shut the gas off and the other pipe is touching the frame. It also looks like the front fenders need to be trimmed as well for these pipes to work. I am pretty sure I have the stingers on correctly, the Toomey logo faces away from the bike correct, if so then they are mounted correct. I guess I am going to be spending the weekend getting this straightened out Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sredish Posted September 29, 2007 Report Share Posted September 29, 2007 (edited) The Toomey needles are supposed to be the culprits in a lot of mid throttle issues, so I have new stock needles coming Good boy John. :biggrin: I felt like the power be more like an on off switch. The is hardly anything and then it hauls off nicely. I am not sure if this bike is setup right, it feels faster on the pipe, but elsewhere is blows big time. :thumbsup: This sounds familiar, I think I've said this before... not to you particularly John, but as I've said before, I'm not a fan of the T5 power. It has a very lightswitch powerband. A 2-1 carb kit helps but the only real solution if you don't like it is to change pipes. Many people just gear the bike way down to help with the low end, but this is just a serious band-aid IMO. I didn't like my T5s at all, from the fit / finish, to the power production. I got them on and couldn't wait to get them off. I've said it before but people always argue with me and "All Hail the Toomey". :yelrotflmao: Try and find some PT Hi Revs, much smoother, incredible midrange and topend. With a 2-1 kit, it has surprisingly decent low end and doesn't "hit" like that. Good luck with the needles, getting the needles adjusted properly should help some. Let us know how it works out. Edited September 29, 2007 by sredish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted September 29, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 29, 2007 Good boy John. :biggrin: :thumbsup: This sounds familiar, I think I've said this before... not to you particularly John, but as I've said before, I'm not a fan of the T5 power. It has a very lightswitch powerband. A 2-1 carb kit helps but the only real solution if you don't like it is to change pipes. Many people just gear the bike way down to help with the low end, but this is just a serious band-aid IMO. I didn't like my T5s at all, from the fit / finish, to the power production. I got them on and couldn't wait to get them off. I've said it before but people always argue with me and "All Hail the Toomey". :yelrotflmao: Try and find some PT Hi Revs, much smoother, incredible midrange and topend. With a 2-1 kit, it has surprisingly decent low end and doesn't "hit" like that. Good luck with the needles, getting the needles adjusted properly should help some. Let us know how it works out. Yea I am going to get the fluid leak fixed, which I believe is a coolant line after looking through my manual at picture diagrams all morning. Maybe the powerband will be much better after I make the changes with the needles and get the clips in the right position. It's not that the bike doesn't haul, it does, but I feel a slight hesitation and stumble. I am probably going to look into a set of Paul Turners and probably pick them up. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted September 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Yea I am going to get the fluid leak fixed, which I believe is a coolant line after looking through my manual at picture diagrams all morning. Maybe the powerband will be much better after I make the changes with the needles and get the clips in the right position. It's not that the bike doesn't haul, it does, but I feel a slight hesitation and stumble. I am probably going to look into a set of Paul Turners and probably pick them up. Ok so after disassembling the the front plastics and gas tank again, I pull the mystery line out and it runs to the middle of rats nest of lines and wires and come to a t-fitting. The one side of the T-fitting goes to the right side case. The other goes straight back and goes into what would be the rear side of the motor right before the top rear shock mount. Any ideas on where this mystery tube goes? I can't find anything in the manual that shows this and after my third headache from this I am just about ready to bring it in to the local shop. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sredish Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 (edited) Is it black? It sounds like the case vent tube. There's a vent hole right in the very back of the case where the swinger mounts. Its a bitch to get to kinda but if you look back there, it connects there back where the carb vent lines go down. One back there and the one on the right side goes up and into the T, then vents out. Edited September 30, 2007 by sredish Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted September 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Is it black? It sounds like the case vent tube. There's a vent hole right in the very back of the case where the swinger mounts. Its a bitch to get to kinda but if you look back there, it connects there back where the carb vent lines go down. One back there and the one on the right side goes up and into the T, then vents out. Yes the hose is black, I have that connected to the back of of the case and the other goes to the right side case, then I have one that goes all the way up the front of the bike and and weaves its way across the frame and was factory tied to the frame it appears, but it spews out fluid. I believe the fluid is brake fluid because the bike puked all over the patio and I poured water on it and it began to dissolve and wash away. I also checked my coolant and that is green. So I have pretty much eliminated coolant as being a fluid. Still leaning towards brake fluid. I guess I will give it a shot tomorrow otherwise I am bringing it to the local shop, they usually help me out and answer all my questions no problem. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sredish Posted September 30, 2007 Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Yes the hose is black, I have that connected to the back of of the case and the other goes to the right side case, then I have one that goes all the way up the front of the bike and and weaves its way across the frame and was factory tied to the frame it appears, but it spews out fluid. I believe the fluid is brake fluid because the bike puked all over the patio and I poured water on it and it began to dissolve and wash away. I also checked my coolant and that is green. So I have pretty much eliminated coolant as being a fluid. Still leaning towards brake fluid. I guess I will give it a shot tomorrow otherwise I am bringing it to the local shop, they usually help me out and answer all my questions no problem. Well, it can't be brake fluid as the brake fluid is sealed and is not running through those black lines. How are your brakes? If it was brake fluid leaking, your brake lever would feel it. The line you mentioned is a vent line and must be spewing some crankcase oil. Is your crankcase getting pressurized? Start it up and open the crankcase fill hole, squeeze that line closed and put your thumb over it to see if you feel any pressure. I don't really think you'd see much brake fluid if it was dripping, unless you saw it while it was still wet. The line you mentioned, I believe, should run up to the front then up by the upper stem mount and vent there, bent 180 so the opening is facing down, of course. If it's farther down towards the lower part of the frame, maybe there's a draw there pulling some oil out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted September 30, 2007 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2007 Well, it can't be brake fluid as the brake fluid is sealed and is not running through those black lines. How are your brakes? If it was brake fluid leaking, your brake lever would feel it. The line you mentioned is a vent line and must be spewing some crankcase oil. Is your crankcase getting pressurized? Start it up and open the crankcase fill hole, squeeze that line closed and put your thumb over it to see if you feel any pressure. I don't really think you'd see much brake fluid if it was dripping, unless you saw it while it was still wet. The line you mentioned, I believe, should run up to the front then up by the upper stem mount and vent there, bent 180 so the opening is facing down, of course. If it's farther down towards the lower part of the frame, maybe there's a draw there pulling some oil out. Would reqular oil dissolve and breakdown and wash away, it would normally stain the surface it's on though. Other than that I am stumped, not sure what the real issue is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sredish Posted October 1, 2007 Report Share Posted October 1, 2007 Do you have an overflow bottle or is it just vented out / bypassed like mine? That sounds like what it is. I just read your whole post thoroughly. I've been out of town and haven't had a lot of time so I've been working on minimal info. The smoke sounds like coolant and the drip is sometimes common like that with a bypasses coolant vent line. What is coming out of the tube would normally go into the bottle and then there you go with the lack of staining issue and smoke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Posted October 2, 2007 Author Report Share Posted October 2, 2007 Do you have an overflow bottle or is it just vented out / bypassed like mine? That sounds like what it is. I just read your whole post thoroughly. I've been out of town and haven't had a lot of time so I've been working on minimal info. The smoke sounds like coolant and the drip is sometimes common like that with a bypasses coolant vent line. What is coming out of the tube would normally go into the bottle and then there you go with the lack of staining issue and smoke. I can eliminate coolant because the fluid coming out isn't green, which is the color of my coolant. This tube is like a crankcase breather tube, it runs the whole length of the bike and has a t-fitting by the carbs, one splits off and runs to the right side case and the other goes to the back of the crankcase where the top shock mount is. I am not sure why there is such a high pressure buildup now that the fluid will travel the whole length of the bike on an uphill to spew out. My local atv shop initially thought top end, but the bike starts, runs and moves fine besides the slight jetting issue. They then said a possible crank case main seal... but I have a hard time believing that a bike with less than 40hours on it total can be wearing out already. I just received my TORS removal kit so I am waiting on a few other parts and then I will give it another stab at it. If you have any other suggestions let me know. I am completely out of ideas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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