Crazy05 Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 Whats the R for on my plugs. Can I run with the non R B8ES? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bansh-eman Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 the R means its a resistor plug... the plug has a resistor built into it to help cut back any frequancy interferance... when running cdis or higher out out coils they give off interferance in radiowaves.. this interferance can cause issues with a consistant spark and this is where the r comes in... same plug but with a resistor.. spark is just as hot lasts same amount of time... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blowit Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 the R means its a resistor plug... the plug has a resistor built into it to help cut back any frequancy interferance... when running cdis or higher out out coils they give off interferance in radiowaves.. this interferance can cause issues with a consistant spark and this is where the r comes in... same plug but with a resistor.. spark is just as hot lasts same amount of time... Right on. The CDI is not affected by the lack of the resistor code but injection systems PWM outputs can be affected but I have personally never seen it. The CDI is very well protected with caps to smooth odd frequencies. I can guarantee a difference in car stereos though when running non resistor plugs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bansh-eman Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 blowit you seem very knowledgeable in electronics... can you explain to me why dyna says to run a resistor with thier cdi if they are protected? my guess would b that they are protected from reciveing interferance but not sending out? im the worlds worst with electronics.. thats why im in the military and my bros an electrican Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blowit Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 blowit you seem very knowledgeable in electronics... can you explain to me why dyna says to run a resistor with thier cdi if they are protected? my guess would b that they are protected from receivng interferance but not sending out? im the worlds worst with electronics.. thats why im in the military and my bros an electrican And I can tell you my twin brother is a double E and we hooked labview to a banshee just to look at the ripple voltage because we offer an electronic shift kit for the banshee. I am personally high voltage certified. I am not a DA in the electronics field nor is it my intent to offend. I offered that info from an honest test data prospective and I would not throw that out unknowingly. In our testing, the resistor plug did not show any difference in line harmonics or transients. I can tell you the banshee power output is damn dirty. Transient spikes on that bike scare me but that CDI survives none the less. I would say Dyna is wanting insurance on that deal. I will investigate this a little though because you have me thinking but rest assured, I am NOT electronics illiterate. Do you design and build PCBs from scratch?? Maybe you do. Brandon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bansh-eman Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 if you could find out a little more i know it would be a ton of helpful knwoledge... casue the question comes up at least every month or so but being no one can give a 100% for sure accuate answer its left to speculation... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blowit Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 if you could find out a little more i know it would be a ton of helpful knwoledge... casue the question comes up at least every month or so but being no one can give a 100% for sure accuate answer its left to speculation... I am not sure what question it is you are refering, but after reading what I wrote, I would say that I in no way endorse the non resistor plugs. They are for lawn mowers. All I am saying is when we did our testing, we did expect to see a large difference in back talk from the plug, but we did not see it and tested 4 bikes. You would sure think that the R plugs should be a must and there is always a possibility that we missed something in testing but we do not call out R plugs for our shifters only because after we got the data, we built a hell for stout power supply for our circuit. We do not need failures. The banshee power is so irratic, it's hard to filter, even for testing. OUR DAQ system had to be updated just to help decipher the data. We knew the constant loss ignitions would be tough. The electric start machines are surprisingly clean. I will say this, that banshee CDI may last a lifetime if it had cleaner power. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blowit Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 I am not sure what question it is you are refering, but after reading what I wrote, I would say that I in no way endorse the non resistor plugs. They are for lawn mowers. All I am saying is when we did our testing, we did expect to see a large difference in back talk from the plug, but we did not see it and tested 4 bikes. You would sure think that the R plugs should be a must and there is always a possibility that we missed something in testing but we do not call out R plugs for our shifters only because after we got the data, we built a hell for stout power supply for our circuit. We do not need failures. The banshee power is so irratic, it's hard to filter, even for testing. OUR DAQ system had to be updated just to help decipher the data. We knew the constant loss ignitions would be tough. The electric start machines are surprisingly clean. I will say this, that banshee CDI may last a lifetime if it had cleaner power. I also stated that the CDI is fine without the R plug but what I should have stated is there was no difference in power quality with or without the R plugs. With all those transients, it would just seem a matter of time before a DC buss was overloaded and started leaking AC in the CDI. Whether the R will or will not detour a misfire is something we did not test for. Our objective at the time was to test power quality at all operating loads and rpms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy05 Posted March 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 What would be the best way to clean up the power then, if it is so bad? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blowit Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 (edited) What would be the best way to clean up the power then, if it is so bad? We never had a reason to repair the power issues at hand and I am sure this applies to all constant loss ignitions. I guess if someone is concerned, adding capacitance to the system is the first defense against transients. Those CDIs have to have pretty good guts to cope with the power. The cap will act as a shock absorber and smooth some ripples. There is just no data that I have that would indicate that cleaner power would extent the life of the CDI. This is just a "theory" we have. I am confident, even if we spend the hours of time designing a part to fix it, someone would just duplicate it and call it their own. We just cannot see any marketable reason to pursue a "clean power" module. Brandon Edited March 16, 2007 by blowit Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trueraiderfan Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 Damn dude your a smart sum bitch :biggrin:. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajogejr Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 We never had a reason to repair the power issues at hand and I am sure this applies to all constant loss ignitions. I guess if someone is concerned, adding capacitance to the system is the first defense against transients. Those CDIs have to have pretty good guts to cope with the power. The cap will act as a shock absorber and smooth some ripples. There is just no data that I have that would indicate that cleaner power would extent the life of the CDI. This is just a "theory" we have. I am confident, even if we spend the hours of time designing a part to fix it, someone would just duplicate it and call it their own. We just cannot see any marketable reason to pursue a "clean power" module. Brandon Brandon, I'm as dumb as a rock when it comes to electronics....to further fry your noodle, here's one for you. As said, Dyna recommends R plugs for their ignition. Now...I run a Nology Coil with their hot wires. (Their hot wires have resistors built in) Nology recommends running NON-resistor plugs with their coil and hotwires. So...tell me....who is right? I can tell you I ran standard old BR8ES last year on my cub with healthy compression (185 PSI) and and a TON of timing, and never had an ignition problem.... I was just looking at your thoughts. Better yet, I'd be happy to send you my Dyna and Nology together if you felt the need to test it out.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blowit Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 Brandon, I'm as dumb as a rock when it comes to electronics....to further fry your noodle, here's one for you.As said, Dyna recommends R plugs for their ignition. Now...I run a Nology Coil with their hot wires. (Their hot wires have resistors built in) Nology recommends running NON-resistor plugs with their coil and hotwires. So...tell me....who is right? I can tell you I ran standard old BR8ES last year on my cub with healthy compression (185 PSI) and and a TON of timing, and never had an ignition problem.... I was just looking at your thoughts. Better yet, I'd be happy to send you my Dyna and Nology together if you felt the need to test it out.... I feel that a huge amount of testing would have to go into suppressing back talk from the plugs by means of wires and or plugs. many cars today use both. Not because of the misfire concern, but all the sensitive engine management sensors on board. Piezoelectric sensors can be faulted by this back talk pretty easily. Suppressive wire and plugs are a must and all PCMs are STILL heavily protected because they need PC type power. Clean as a whistle. I feel that if too much resistance is used in the banshee (no HEI) you may reduce the effective voltage to the plug. After all, this is one way we buck voltage down, by adding resistance in series in a circuit. Parallel acts as a power absorber. Either way, not good for a bike that already has wimpy spark. I would follow the OEM specs but I would sure prefer suppressive wire rather than R plugs if I had to pick. Brandon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajogejr Posted March 16, 2007 Report Share Posted March 16, 2007 I feel that a huge amount of testing would have to go into suppressing back talk from the plugs by means of wires and or plugs. many cars today use both. Not because of the misfire concern, but all the sensitive engine management sensors on board. Piezoelectric sensors can be faulted by this back talk pretty easily. Suppressive wire and plugs are a must and all PCMs are STILL heavily protected because they need PC type power. Clean as a whistle. I feel that if too much resistance is used in the banshee (no HEI) you may reduce the effective voltage to the plug. After all, this is one way we buck voltage down, by adding resistance in series in a circuit. Parallel acts as a power absorber. Either way, not good for a bike that already has wimpy spark. I would follow the OEM specs but I would sure prefer suppressive wire rather than R plugs if I had to pick. Brandon Fair enough... I will have to try R vs. non R plugs this year. I'm running alky on my bike this year, and as you know...it takes a pretty good spark to light it off...hence the reason for a smaller gap in comparison to gas. Thanks for the input... Sorry to hijack the thread! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crazy05 Posted March 17, 2007 Author Report Share Posted March 17, 2007 OK, so it may not be maketable, so what. Devise a cheap fix and help a brotha out. Size of cap and where to put it. Shouldnt take to much for someone with your expert knowledge in the subject. As shitty as the spark is in our bikes, it seems to hold up. If you know a way to make it last, Ive heard they fail a lot, then a fix for longevity would be a great contribution to the community. If you want to keep it hush, then PM me with the fix. I will not say a word to anyone till you get your patent. The the word will be to call you. My bike is fairly new and dont want any issues that can be avoided. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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