redneck Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Hey everybody my friend has a 97 has always been hard to start after pulling to get started and the motor got warm starts first kick....took reeds out and bought some reed,cage combo something v3 dont know exactly. Right after that it started first kick or two thought hell yeah this thing is fixed. then took out for a test ride I was not impressed felt real slow (thought it might still be a little cold still) then my buddy road for about five mins and then shee came to life, he said shee is running good let her rip, so I go out on the street and launch this thing as hard as I can just spinning on me hit second (was like hell yeah) hit third then clicked to fourth and realized I was not giving it gas and it was still going hard as hell. Turned it off and pushed to the garage to check for throttel cable to be stuck and was not. Took the lid off of the air box and looked in to the carbs to see they both are returning all the way down and they are. I just dont know if the plastic thing that goes under the jet could come off and that is what is doing this... I am going to work on this thing tomorrow so any in put would be, He tried to start it today and it would not start after about 50 kicks :: I think its something to do with the carbs, it does have a twist throttle. thanks redneck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fox_forma Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 Hey everybody my friend has a 97 has always been hard to start after pulling to get started and the motor got warm starts first kick....took reeds out and bought some reed,cage combo something v3 dont know exactly. Right after that it started first kick or two thought hell yeah this thing is fixed. then took out for a test ride I was not impressed felt real slow (thought it might still be a little cold still) then my buddy road for about five mins and then shee came to life, he said shee is running good let her rip, so I go out on the street and launch this thing as hard as I can just spinning on me hit second (was like hell yeah) hit third then clicked to fourth and realized I was not giving it gas and it was still going hard as hell. Turned it off and pushed to the garage to check for throttel cable to be stuck and was not. Took the lid off of the air box and looked in to the carbs to see they both are returning all the way down and they are. I just dont know if the plastic thing that goes under the jet could come off and that is what is doing this... I am going to work on this thing tomorrow so any in put would be, He tried to start it today and it would not start after about 50 kicks :: I think its something to do with the carbs, it does have a twist throttle. thanks redneck What jets are you running? If your lean, it can make it hard to start when cold but be normal when its warmed up. A lot of things can factor in as well, such as an air leak somewhere or something. What do you plugs look like? Also make sure your floats are adjusted correctly and everything is nice and clean on there. As for throttle sticking open, make sure your cable is routed correctly and its not getting hung up on anything. Also make sure your cable isnt worn out. Since you will prob be pulling the carbs, go over the cable while your at it just to make sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redneck Posted October 17, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 What jets are you running? If your lean, it can make it hard to start when cold but be normal when its warmed up. A lot of things can factor in as well, such as an air leak somewhere or something. What do you plugs look like? Also make sure your floats are adjusted correctly and everything is nice and clean on there. As for throttle sticking open, make sure your cable is routed correctly and its not getting hung up on anything. Also make sure your cable isnt worn out. Since you will prob be pulling the carbs, go over the cable while your at it just to make sure. The jets are what came with the fmf kit.... (did not jet after the reeds because they were supposed to be boysens in there before) they might be a little lean (gray)when I look in through the air box to watch the slides go up and down the come right down when you release throttle. so thats why I think its something in the carbs. Hey thanks redneck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fox_forma Posted October 17, 2006 Report Share Posted October 17, 2006 The hard start does sound like a lean condition, eventhough fmf supplied the jets, each bike is different and sometimes they can be a little off. Have you tried turning the air screw in at all to see if that helps at all with the cold start? If you turn it in and it helps then richen up the pilots a little. Either way def pull the carbs and inspect them for debris and float adjustment. Also eventhough you checked to see if the slides were going up and down they can still get hung up when riding the bike on occassion, it only takes a second for it to get hung up and have you at WOT and let you know something isnt right. Also if not the cable, check for air leaks around the intake boots, and like mentioned def check the floats and make sure they are adjusted right, if either are present (cracks causing and air leak, or floats adjusted wrong) you could be starving for fuel which can also create a lean condition and make the bike REV out when riding. Good luck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redneck Posted October 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 ok now the bike started but it took like 40 kicks. now it bogging on low rpm's, if u go a 1/4 of a throttle or more it boggs. if u barely climb the rpm's it is good. also I put in brand new b8es plugs and after about 15 minutes of it running while bogging, took them out to them being greyish brown. whats does that mean. the bike came with 265 mains with the fmf pipe. and it still has the stock pilots so whatever they are. what 25's I think. if anyone could help I would greatly appreciate it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
akita8 Posted October 18, 2006 Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 (edited) If the TORS are removed make sure that you have the correct free play at the throttle (if you don't have the freeplay the throttle could stick) and then back the idle adjustments off equally, enough that the slides are bottomed out. Next check that when you move the throttle the slides move at the exact same time (if not adjust them at the top of the carbs). Sometimes the idle adjustment is high and floods the engine on the first kick. Start it up and adjust the idle equally until you get to a good idle. I would set the airscrews back to 1.5 turns out and start from there. I would also make sure that the slides are not backwards and the choke tube is secure. Edited October 18, 2006 by akita8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redneck Posted October 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 If the TORS are removed make sure that you have the correct free play at the throttle (if you don't have the freeplay the throttle could stick) and then back the idle adjustments off equally, enough that the slides are bottomed out. Next check that when you move the throttle the slides move at the exact same time (if not adjust them at the top of the carbs). Sometimes the idle adjustment is high and floods the engine on the first kick. Start it up and adjust the idle equally until you get to a good idle. I would set the airscrews back to 1.5 turns out and start from there. I would also make sure that the slides are not backwards and the choke tube is secure. I have a twist throttle so I dont think that the tors is there?? I have a grayish brown plug that is good right? I have some bottle end boggin. if you are ideling and you go to take off seems to bog more than normal. If you are rolling with no gas and then nail it it boggs right down, if you nail it and then get out of it it wont die.Once past the bog runs real strong. :: Thanks redneck : Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajogejr Posted October 18, 2006 Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 Do yourself a favor and quit riding that bike. There should be NO gray or silver on the plugs. The motor is trying to tell you something, but...you're starting it up...warming it up...and beating the piss out of it. You need to at the very least do a compression check. If you're getting silver or gray on the plugs, 99 times out of 100 that means the aluminum piston is starting to come apart. That is caused by a number of different condition and/or problems. Normal wear, time for a fresh top end. Too lean of jetting, melting the pistons Too much timing Air leak... The longer you ride that bike, the more money it's gonna cost to fix it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redneck Posted October 18, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 Do yourself a favor and quit riding that bike. There should be NO gray or silver on the plugs. The motor is trying to tell you something, but...you're starting it up...warming it up...and beating the piss out of it. You need to at the very least do a compression check. If you're getting silver or gray on the plugs, 99 times out of 100 that means the aluminum piston is starting to come apart. That is caused by a number of different condition and/or problems. Normal wear, time for a fresh top end. Too lean of jetting, melting the pistons Too much timing Air leak... The longer you ride that bike, the more money it's gonna cost to fix it. dajorg My plugs were good before I put in the new carbon fiber reeds...I will have to get a hold of a compression tester. The motor was rebuilt 2 years ago and has not been out much, I know it dont mean anything but thought I would tell you. I wonder if the reed cages could be leaking. I dont wont to hurt the motor anymore than it might be already. thanks redneck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajogejr Posted October 18, 2006 Report Share Posted October 18, 2006 I've got carbon fiber reeds (VForce 3) and my plugs aren't even close to being gray. 40 kicks or a push start on a banshee is not even close to being right. Some of the VForce 2 reeds had a problem with the hold down screw backing out and getting sucked into the motor....hate to say it, but....they did. You're supposed to use a little loctite on the screws that hold the reed petals in. I'd do a leak down and compression test to save yourself future headaches. If it ONLY starting running bad once the reeds were put in, either you installed them wrong, or....you didn't seal them properly.... My guess... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redneck Posted October 19, 2006 Author Report Share Posted October 19, 2006 I've got carbon fiber reeds (VForce 3) and my plugs aren't even close to being gray. 40 kicks or a push start on a banshee is not even close to being right. Some of the VForce 2 reeds had a problem with the hold down screw backing out and getting sucked into the motor....hate to say it, but....they did. You're supposed to use a little loctite on the screws that hold the reed petals in. I'd do a leak down and compression test to save yourself future headaches. If it ONLY starting running bad once the reeds were put in, either you installed them wrong, or....you didn't seal them properly.... My guess... dejorg Hey man thanks for looking and the advice, and will do a compression test. This bike has always been hard to start. This is a buddies bike, and before him it was another buddies bike. Just tring to help him get it right. I put the reeds on and it is possible that they arent the tightest. sense we put the reeds in we have had the bottom end bog more than normal. Thats when we put a new set of plugs in and checked them. Thanks again redneck Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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