sandornothing Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 As my screen name says, Im soley a duner. If i decide on this this mod, is it one of those "trade off" mods where you loose more topend but gain bottom end? or vise versa? Also, with mods in my sig, i run the premium pump fuel here in san diego which is 91 octane, and beleive it or not with no adverse affects. However, if i do this +4 timing key my Qs are: does this timing advance assist in over heating? Will i be OK with a 50/50 blend of VP 110 and premium pump fuel? And if this is a low end enhancing mods, and the fact that ive got good compression with the C.H. 20cc's, will it be enough to go to a 15 tooth front sproket? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
banshdog Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 Put one in my bike. it was from Vito's. Had a small dyno chart in the package claiming 1-2HP gain pretty much across the board. I put it in along with other mods so i cant describe the difference that only the key would give. .02 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigboybanshee Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 Sorry I can't help you much on this one, lol, I was wondering the same thing!! I was gonna post a very similar question today until I stumbled across your post Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wallrat Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 I've got the $10 degree key from Alba. While I don't have the domes, I've heard that you can safely run 20cc domes and a +4 advance on 91 octane. Actually the Alba key is more like +3 so there's a bit more insurance. As far as performance-wise, yes its a good purchase. I primarily use my shee for sand and it basically makes it feel more peppy across the throttle range. Its not gonna be night and day, but for $10 and 20 minutes to install, its a great mod to have. BTW, some people swear against keys saying that they shear off. This has happenned to some folks on here but I've been running mine for about a year now and never had an issue. Others have run it longer also with no issue. As long as you snug up the flywheel to specs it'll be fine. If you're still unsure, you could pick up an adjustable timing plate from ricky stator for $35. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ledofthezep Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 BTW, some people swear against keys saying that they shear off. This has happenned to some folks on here but I've been running mine for about a year now and never had an issue. Others have run it longer also with no issue. As long as you snug up the flywheel to specs it'll be fine. If you're still unsure, you could pick up an adjustable timing plate from ricky stator for $35. Werd. Hit & Miss as to people's preferences & misfortunes...I had to get a new stator so I just went with the RS stock stator on the adjustable plate for $125; no regrets. I still would probably spend the extra 20-25 bucks for an adjustable plate. Just MHO... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fixitrod Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 You will notice an improvement across the board with +4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sandornothing Posted September 30, 2004 Author Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 Yeah, ive heard the horror stories about the key shearing off in there. That was going to be my next question, how reliable is it? but it looks as if it has been answered already "hit or miss" right? If i go with the adjustable stator plate will i need to get a timing light and set that again. Can someone in a nutshell explain the install on that one and i'll weigh the difference indifficulty and go with the best bang i guess. Are domes and a timing advance enough for a 15 tooth front sproket in the dunes? I do a little of it all out there.... race, hill shoot, dune, jump, and the occasional over the bars leap down the razor or into the witches eye. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fixitrod Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 The only way a key will shear is if the flywheel isn't tightened properly. The key is just there to index the flywheel while putting in on. You should be able to pull a 15 pretty easy with just pipes and air box mod. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ledofthezep Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 If i go with the adjustable stator plate will i need to get a timing light and set that again. Can someone in a nutshell explain the install on that one and i'll weigh the difference indifficulty and go with the best bang i guess. No timing light needed...you set your timing to a mark on the case(see pic). Basically, if you get the ricky stator plate, you just replace it with your stock plate & put everything back together...not much to it at all. Meat's got some info on the degree key & installation on his site, found here: http://www.thebansheezone.com/Bansheezone/...KeyInstallation Thanks Meat! Here's a pic of the RS timing plate -- http://www.rickystator.com/pages/Yamaha_Ba...ming_plate.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sredish Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 or you can just put the slot in your stocker for FREEE and have the same adjustability. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightrider Posted September 30, 2004 Report Share Posted September 30, 2004 Like Fitit says,the key is only as good as the person who installed it.The flywheel must be torqued to specs and avoid putting any locking compound or anti seize on the shaft or in the keyway. Its a taper lock design.When torqued to the proper specs,the nut actually produces a press fit.The force thats applied actually makes the flywheel bore "bite" down on the tapered part of the shaft. Just wipe the shaft with a light film of oil before you reinstall the flywheel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fixitrod Posted October 1, 2004 Report Share Posted October 1, 2004 Like Fitit says,the key is only as good as the person who installed it.The flywheel must be torqued to specs and avoid putting any locking compound or anti seize on the shaft or in the keyway. Its a taper lock design.When torqued to the proper specs,the nut actually produces a press fit.The force thats applied actually makes the flywheel bore "bite" down on the tapered part of the shaft. Just wipe the shaft with a light film of oil before you reinstall the flywheel. I actually use anti-seize with mine. It's been fine for 3 yrs Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banchetta Posted October 1, 2004 Report Share Posted October 1, 2004 The key will give you 2hp across the whole curve. No takeaways anywhere...I got a adjustable plate and gained on my stock porting and my stroker..Both setups like the +4 the best. I'd strongely suggest it. For the money, the mod is cheap....Like Rod and nightrider said...the key installation is what caused them to shear.....Install it right and you won't have a problem. You have to torque them. I've seen shees will sheared stock keys... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nightrider Posted October 1, 2004 Report Share Posted October 1, 2004 (edited) I actually use anti-seize with mine. It's been fine for 3 yrs I never said you couldn't,but like you said its there to index the flywheel,not to hold the rotational force.Thats a no-no in the industrial mechanics world. My profession is a millwright and I can tell you by experience thats never done on tapered spindles,especially ones that see that type of rotational force and torque. To make it plain and simple.take two sheets of 1/4" steel 4x8 feet and stack 2000 lbs on it,now take 2 more sheets of 1/4"steel 4x8 feet,but this time spread a thin layer of anti seize between them and stack on the 2000lbs. Obviously the sheets with the antiseize are going to slide much easier and will require less force to move them. When you torque the flywheel nut ,you are creating a "press fit"betwwen the spindle and bore.The force is soo great that the bore actually clamps on the spindleshaft locking it in place like a vise grip.Anti seize does just what it says,it prevents parts from seizing together,but in reality thats how the taper shaft works. I'd say you've been lucky,but in the future I'd avoid anti-seize.Even a light film of lithium grease would be ok.Just a little FYI Edited October 1, 2004 by Nightrider Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banchetta Posted October 1, 2004 Report Share Posted October 1, 2004 I would also think that, but I've grown up in the fishing industry where the propellers are held on by tapered shafts and keyways....If you don't put antisieze on the shaft, then you'll never get the propeller off again....I've seen fisherman using 5 ton jacks behind the prop and hitting the shaft w/ a sledge hammer and the prop still wouldn't budge...Put some antisieze and next time it just pops right off. Never had any fisherman lose thier props either....We have guys up here swinging 32" props w/ diesel motors pushing over 1000lbs of torque.....I know it doesn't make sense, but its true...I use antisieze on all my tapered shafts that I've ever come across.....makes life a lot easier.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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