Banshee Track/Trail Build

[mrparty21]

I am converting my 421 Banshee to a track/trail build. I want to build a banshee that I can ride 50/50 at the track and in the tight CT trails. I spend Saturdays at the tracks here in New England, mostly MX23 in Mass. Also want to do a couple of races this year, not an entire series. I also ride in the trails around here which kind of suck, but i'm looking to go to upstate NY/VT/NH a few times this year where the trials are much more open and there's some big fields I can get wide open in. The 421 setup I had sucked for trails and track.

What parts should I put on my bike to make it suited for all of the above?

Engine:
Currently I'm getting stock cylinders ported by Herr Jugs. He's doing his MX hardcore port
4mil Long rod crank
21cc Domes
Coolhead
Stock Carbs with Vito's needles
Billet manifold with Chariot reeds
Paul Turner Mids (if they ever come back in stock)
Stock air box with lid removed

Controls:
Trail Tech Vapor
ASV Levers
Flexx Bars
Alba +2 Stem
Alba Nerf Bars

Suspension:
Wicked +2 A-arms
Tusk Extended Axle (+1 to +3)
Lone Star billet hubs
Elka Legacy Long travel front and rear shocks
Elka Long travel linkage
Swingarm ?
14/40 sprockets (honda pattern hub). DID regular chain

Questions:
1. What length swingarm should I run. I have a lonestar +2 on that I was using with my 421. I see some guys saying that -1 makes the bike feel like a 250r. What do they mean by that? Do you guys recommend a -1 or stock length?
2. What wheels/tires do you guys recommend I run for this setup? RIght now im on 10 inch wheels (3/2 offset) with hoosier trail tires. Was thinking about trying a set of 8inch wheels with a 4/1 offset on the track and using the 10 inchers in the trail. (and go down to a 38t sprocket with the 8inchers)
3. Is there anything I should consider changing or adding?

[mrparty21]

[mrparty21]

[Metal_man_Rob]

I can't help with any of the engine stuff. Mine is stock but all I ride are wooded trails here. I live in NH. The tight handling suck with a +2 swing arm. I went back to stock length roundhouse. 

You already have the widened axle and a arms. Your suspension adjustment would possibly have to be tweaked if you're going to do some of the areas here in NH like clough/dunbarton or jericho. I ride the shit the 4x4 guys think they own and always get stuck behind them.

One thing I did that I am happy about that most people would argue is the larger tires. I run 22 rear and 23 front. Now I am having to completely readjust my front end for it. 

The biggest piece of advice I can give you for NH trails is, at minimum, a rear skid plate. It doesn't look like you have one in the photos but you will need one. If you've ridden here in NH I am sure you already know.

[tfaith08]

I mean you pretty well have it wrapped up.

Biggest thing I can add is to go with nerfs that have race position pegs, gripper seat, 4/1 rims, make sure the suspension and alignment is dialed in, and cut as much weight off as possible, especially off the front.

Roll your controls down a little more than normal as well.

Above all else, you want to get comfortable at riding aggressively. A lot of people unintentionally hold their breath during corners or jumps. Once you do that, you can really start to identify what needs to be fixed as far as ergonomics go.


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[mrparty21]

On 1/10/2022 at 7:39 PM, DDQ said:

For mx racing, even local, you will need a tether kill switch and number plates. In NC number plates are required even when using transponders. Also,in some districts, lights must be covered or removed for safety. 

Your setup will be pretty fun. Good job buying PT mids. If you want to cancel your order from Duncan they are pretty readily available used. If you want to go that route I can help you locate a set.

You really need to use 8" rear wheels with 18" tires or you run the risk of bending wheels. Some tracks demand low air pressure (I raced with guys in FL running 1 psi) to get good traction.  I'd recommend 4:1 offset. It will be narrower but handle better. Most local district races will not measure width but there is a chance you will have to drive through the boards. 50" is the max legal limit. You can use trail tires but you will get much more tired faster than using mx tires. You will get 10x more tired in a mx race than you have ever gotten practicing. I promise. 

For swingarm length I like stock. I ran a -1.5 for years and went back to stock length. I just think the quad handles a little better at stock. Also, fun fact, stock length is what Duncan used on their national mx banshee back in the early 2000's. 

Sprocket size is useless to speculate on. You will likely need to change gearing from track to track. I carry a variety of sprockets and chains when I go to tracks and change them accordingly after a couple practice laps. 

Thank you,

I have  teather switch on already. Number plates i'll get taken care of

If you could help me locate a set of PT mids that would be awesome!

Ill order a set of DWT champion in a box or locate a used set for the rears and ill pair them with some hoosier/cst/obor mx tires. I should be under 50" with a 4/1 offset

I need to find a Lonestar stock length roundhouse swingarm or source a used set, then sell my +2.

Ill buy a few different chain and sprocket combinations once the rest of the quad is almost done. I usually stick with steel sprockets and DID gold chains

Also forgot to mention I have a urmosi throttle 😆

 

[mrparty21]

On 1/11/2022 at 6:39 AM, tfaith08 said:

I mean you pretty well have it wrapped up.

Biggest thing I can add is to go with nerfs that have race position pegs, gripper seat, 4/1 rims, make sure the suspension and alignment is dialed in, and cut as much weight off as possible, especially off the front.

Roll your controls down a little more than normal as well.

Above all else, you want to get comfortable at riding aggressively. A lot of people unintentionally hold their breath during corners or jumps. Once you do that, you can really start to identify what needs to be fixed as far as ergonomics go.


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Do you know which nerfs have a race peg? I have alba nerfs right now. Not that many companies make nerfs for the banshee as far as I know there's Lonestar, XFR, and Alba (and all the other brands that are the exact same as alba). 

I would love to run a set of Rath/Factory 43 nerfs with the full nets but I don't think those brands offer an option for the banshee. Wonder if anyone has done a custom setup that isn't too hard. 

Also, the nerf bars I have on right now have custom nets from JSR Moto Designs

[T13]

Factory 43 makes a nerf bar for the banshee. Might need a shorter shifter. Peg location is not stock

[tfaith08]

Do you know which nerfs have a race peg? I have alba nerfs right now. Not that many companies make nerfs for the banshee as far as I know there's Lonestar, XFR, and Alba (and all the other brands that are the exact same as alba). 
I would love to run a set of Rath/Factory 43 nerfs with the full nets but I don't think those brands offer an option for the banshee. Wonder if anyone has done a custom setup that isn't too hard. 
Also, the nerf bars I have on right now have custom nets from JSR Moto Designs

I’ve had my feet on all the different nerds. Factory 43 is worth every cent. Need a shorter shifter and maybe a brake lever depending on how you brake. I usually stand on the brake lever when I use it so I don’t need it quite as long.


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[specialblend07]

2 hours ago, DDQ said:

Sorry but I have been unable to locate used mids. Just a couple months ago I knew a guy with several sets. 

 

Duncan just built a banshee with a new set. Worth calling them

[peterlocal22]

I run a -2 swing arm and love it over stock but a bigger tire size will rub against it when suspensionis compressed.  However if I was to do it again I would go with a -1.

Nerf bars, skid plates, hyper beedlock wheels are all a must.

Ive ran diff pipes and the Toomey T5s are still my fav for woods.

Good luck with your build