Tedder Posted August 25, 2021 Report Share Posted August 25, 2021 In response to a great question by RagunCajun I thought I'd throw out some trans info including various shifting problems and fixes I've had over the years. His quote "please report back once the pro mod is in. I went from an override to pro mod so I don't know how much better a pro mod is over stock." I'm the odd man out here running airshifted auto 1-4 m5&6 overrides (asphalt) but my son runs 6 speed promods for dirt drags, asphalt and secondary road riding which is legal here in Ohio. My overrides require ignition kill to shift into the non-cut 5th and 6th gears. Without unloading the tranny gear pressure no upshift will happen. My son ran stock trannies for years before upgrading to promods. When it comes to making super-fast "fan the clutch" type shifts his promods are without a doubt easier and far more reliable in making constant shifts over his OEM's but other than that situation I personally don't feel a promod has a great advantage... With regards to the following keep in mind that the troubles we ran into over the years were under race, wide open throttle type conditions/situations: The FIRST thing either of us will do when we run into missed quick shift situations at the track is change the oil. When the oil gets contaminated with clutch material it seems to cause problems with the smooth sliding internals when under pressure. I especially have to watch this in my asphalt Banshee's with multi-stage clutches which slip out of the hole because clutch material sheds off so much faster than usual. *Something I started doing long ago - Because of the contamination I drain the trans at the end of each race day and filter it through a fine paint strainer then let it sit for months to completely settle anything out. When I fill my tranny I use 1 litre of fresh new oil and top off with the strained. As far as transmission mechanical stuff goes: I'd say for sure that one of the most important adjustments to check if you're having problems is the shift/change lever but make certain that all the individual components are good and within spec because it isn't normal for that adjustment to change to the point of causing shifting trouble unless something is broken or heavily worn. A couple of weak links in Banshee transmissions are (1st) OEM second gears can be broke even with small motors. Be there done that in as small as a 358 cub. Robison billets are great imo and I'll leave it at that... (2nd) 3rd wheel gear has a very narrow area that rides on the splined output shaft and once galled shifting nightmares occur. I recommend Molly paste on assembly. A tube will last you forever. Moroso 35000 Moroso Moly Paste Assembly Lubes | Summit Racing Long winded for sure and I don't want to come off as a know it all because I'm still learning with these things. Just hoping that someone might pickup some useful information on my first hand experiences and maybe spark some interest back at the HQ!! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawa110 Posted August 25, 2021 Report Share Posted August 25, 2021 Experience^^^^Golden info Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClaudeMachining Posted August 26, 2021 Report Share Posted August 26, 2021 In response to a great question by RagunCajun I thought I'd throw out some trans info including various shifting problems and fixes I've had over the years. His quote "please report back once the pro mod is in. I went from an override to pro mod so I don't know how much better a pro mod is over stock." I'm the odd man out here running airshifted auto 1-4 m5&6 overrides (asphalt) but my son runs 6 speed promods for dirt drags, asphalt and secondary road riding which is legal here in Ohio. My overrides require ignition kill to shift into the non-cut 5th and 6th gears. Without unloading the tranny gear pressure no upshift will happen. My son ran stock trannies for years before upgrading to promods. When it comes to making super-fast "fan the clutch" type shifts his promods are without a doubt easier and far more reliable in making constant shifts over his OEM's but other than that situation I personally don't feel a promod has a great advantage... With regards to the following keep in mind that the troubles we ran into over the years were under race, wide open throttle type conditions/situations: The FIRST thing either of us will do when we run into missed quick shift situations at the track is change the oil. When the oil gets contaminated with clutch material it seems to cause problems with the smooth sliding internals when under pressure. I especially have to watch this in my asphalt Banshee's with multi-stage clutches which slip out of the hole because clutch material sheds off so much faster than usual. *Something I started doing long ago - Because of the contamination I drain the trans at the end of each race day and filter it through a fine paint strainer then let it sit for months to completely settle anything out. When I fill my tranny I use 1 litre of fresh new oil and top off with the strained. As far as transmission mechanical stuff goes: I'd say for sure that one of the most important adjustments to check if you're having problems is the shift/change lever but make certain that all the individual components are good and within spec because it isn't normal for that adjustment to change to the point of causing shifting trouble unless something is broken or heavily worn. A couple of weak links in Banshee transmissions are (1st) OEM second gears can be broke even with small motors. Be there done that in as small as a 358 cub. Robison billets are great imo and I'll leave it at that... (2nd) 3rd wheel gear has a very narrow area that rides on the splined output shaft and once galled shifting nightmares occur. I recommend Molly paste on assembly. A tube will last you forever. Moroso 35000 Moroso Moly Paste Assembly Lubes | Summit Racing Long winded for sure and I don't want to come off as a know it all because I'm still learning with these things. Just hoping that someone might pickup some useful information on my first hand experiences and maybe spark some interest back at the HQ!! I like goats.Envoyé de mon SM-N975W en utilisant Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
caleb90 Posted August 28, 2021 Report Share Posted August 28, 2021 Took the shee for a rip this morning. Coming out of a corner in either 3rd or 4th cant remember. Got on the pipe went to grab the next gear hit for a second then went into neutral. No grinding or banging, pulled clutch down shifted and went through the gears no issue. Never had that happen before short shift possibly? Stock trans with easy springs and shift star and shift shaft modded from fast Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawa110 Posted August 29, 2021 Report Share Posted August 29, 2021 Tedder, Going through various boxes of clutches hoarded over the years,(some from you) Metal clutch plates——I have a set that appears to be dimpled and other sets that are smooth. Preference? Did/does Barnett make both heavy duty and “standard” clutch pack springs? How to visually tell a heavy duty spring from standard? Getting ready to replace clutch plates in my desert race bike. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedder Posted August 29, 2021 Author Report Share Posted August 29, 2021 For sure you want smooth steels. Dimpled have been proven to hold less under load on the dyno. Yes Barnett does have Std and heavy duty springs. I have both if you need some. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawa110 Posted August 29, 2021 Report Share Posted August 29, 2021 Thanks. I may need some. Is there a visual difference in the HD springs vs standard? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedder Posted August 29, 2021 Author Report Share Posted August 29, 2021 With them side by side you can see a difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawa110 Posted August 30, 2021 Report Share Posted August 30, 2021 Ceramic ball or pancake bearing on clutch pusher or both? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tedder Posted August 30, 2021 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2021 Pancake bearings are great if running a steel ball and ever since having a ceramic ball shatter in 2006 I've used the OEM steel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RagunCajun Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 On 8/30/2021 at 10:02 AM, kawa110 said: Ceramic ball or pancake bearing on clutch pusher or both? I refuse to run a ceramic because they can shatter. I dont understand the point of risking ceramic shattering when pancake bearings w/ OEM steel balls work fine. On 8/28/2021 at 12:16 PM, caleb90 said: Took the shee for a rip this morning. Coming out of a corner in either 3rd or 4th cant remember. Got on the pipe went to grab the next gear hit for a second then went into neutral. No grinding or banging, pulled clutch down shifted and went through the gears no issue. Never had that happen before short shift possibly? Stock trans with easy springs and shift star and shift shaft modded from fast What helped me dramatically was lowering the shifter one spline. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ClaudeMachining Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 I run both ceramic and pankake.Envoyé de mon SM-N975W en utilisant Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kawa110 Posted September 9, 2021 Report Share Posted September 9, 2021 I have one engine with both(hasn’t been ran). I will be removing it and pancake only. The ceramic ball is larger then the steel(atleast the one I got from FAST) most likely contributing to them shattering. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gusto Posted September 10, 2021 Report Share Posted September 10, 2021 Excellent write up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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