WINDYCITYJOHN400 Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Just keep in mind I'm clueless and am just guessing. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk Obviously ^^^^^ But don't let that stop you from having an opinion based on nothing. Just stating facts about it most people dont realize. Um no... I think your missing the fact that this is aviation purposed fuel. Are you REALLY surprised its alot different than other fuels or did you honestly think its not much different at all? Thats the sad part, not sure why your having a hard time with this. Just like if you switched this around and ran non av gas in planes theres gonna be alot of negatives effects i would only imagine. PS im just guessing btw i dont actually know anything. They should probably rename AV gas to like anything gas or maybe banshee fuel to clear up the confusion. Well your offering up an opinion with only limited knowledge on the subject. (Some call that talking out your ass) And now your being argumentative in defense of your ego…. Thanks for playing…..now let's get some facts straight. They don't mod fuel for use in planes….they highly regulate fuel for use in cars! The main problems with comparing AV gas and pump fuel is that they are regulated and rated differently. 100LL AV fuel is "Low Lead" as far as planes go….but high lead as far as race fuel. Pump gas use to have lead in it to get the octane back in the day. (We called it "regular" and the other stuff was called "unleaded") ALL the good HIGH TEST fuels sold back in the 60's used lead like our race gas does now. As a matter of fact….before catalytic converters ALL the cars ran on leaded fuel! IT DOES NOT BURN DIRTY in your motor. It coats your parts with a fine layer of lead and is an excellent lubricant and well as one of the best ways to gain octane for fighting detonation. A plane only needs to make big power at one point in flight…….TAKEOFF! That's mostly at ground level. Once up high the planes motor is pulled down to a simple steady lower rpm for the remainder of the flight. AV gas is pretty much the same as the old school race gas. Luckily planes don't make up the high majority of fuel use, so the EPA isn't all up in their business forcing them to eliminate the lead. For the record - If you rated AV gas the same as race fuel, the 100LL AV gas would have a motor rating of 108 octane. So I'll say that again for the folks who don't like to read as much…. 100LL AV GAS = 108 RACE GAS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sprinklerman Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Obviously ^^^^^ But don't let that stop you from having an opinion based on nothing. Well your offering up an opinion with only limited knowledge on the subject. (Some call that talking out your ass) And now your being argumentative in defense of your ego…. Thanks for playing…..now let's get some facts straight. They don't mod fuel for use in planes….they highly regulate fuel for use in cars! The main problems with comparing AV gas and pump fuel is that they are regulated and rated differently. 100LL AV fuel is "Low Lead" as far as planes go….but high lead as far as race fuel. Pump gas use to have lead in it to get the octane back in the day. (We called it "regular" and the other stuff was called "unleaded") ALL the good HIGH TEST fuels sold back in the 60's used lead like our race gas does now. As a matter of fact….before catalytic converters ALL the cars ran on leaded fuel! IT DOES NOT BURN DIRTY in your motor. It coats your parts with a fine layer of lead and is an excellent lubricant and well as one of the best ways to gain octane for fighting detonation. A plane only needs to make big power at one point in flight…….TAKEOFF! That's mostly at ground level. Once up high the planes motor is pulled down to a simple steady lower rpm for the remainder of the flight. AV gas is pretty much the same as the old school race gas. Luckily planes don't make up the high majority of fuel use, so the EPA isn't all up in their business forcing them to eliminate the lead. For the record - If you rated AV gas the same as race fuel, the 100LL AV gas would have a motor rating of 108 octane. So I'll say that again for the folks who don't like to read as much…. 100LL AV GAS = 108 RACE GAS I'm glad you took the time to reply..because I sure wasn't. If someone wants to get all defensive when someone questions their opinion ( mis informed at that) so be it. I really don't care. It's just that I don't like someone who's learning to be misinformed. Sent from a van down by the river Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATVridinMaNiAc Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Almost everything you said is true...although you are wrong about it not being modded Lol...yea it is there is different additives in it compared to other shit like I explained... I guess you also think that av gas is damn near the same...oh jus a lil more lead in it that's all. Not. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATVridinMaNiAc Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 How about you do some more research if you can find it. I dare you to find somewhere proving what I said isn't true. Until then you forum dwellers are the ones talking out of asses. Go read up. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chevota84 Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Still avoiding the "weight and balance" bs? Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sprinklerman Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Almost everything you said is true...although you are wrong about it not being modded Lol...yea it is there is different additives in it compared to other shit like I explained... I guess you also think that av gas is damn near the same...oh jus a lil more lead in it that's all. Not. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk How about you do some more research if you can find it. I dare you to find somewhere proving what I said isn't true. Until then you forum dwellers are the ones talking out of asses. Go read up. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk Nobody said it wasn't made for aviation use...duh. what we are saying is it will ALSO work fine for your banshee if you need higher octane than pump gas can provide. And that it will do it well..And that it won't make your engine " dirty" as you put it. Sent from a van down by the river Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WINDYCITYJOHN400 Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 How about you do some more research if you can find it. I dare you to find somewhere proving what I said isn't true. Until then you forum dwellers are the ones talking out of asses. Go read up. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk I already did that years ago. Why should I click and paste just to educate you? Your bike doesn't even make enough power to need good fuel, so what good would the info do you? Did you know you can jump for 110VP to 100LL without even re-jetting? Did you know I back up my knowledge by actually dyno testing? A Jaws bumper and a CFM airbox….FFS That airbox is stealing all the gains from your +4 timing. (I know, I've dyno tested it!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WINDYCITYJOHN400 Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Here you go chief. How long did that take me? Traditional avgas is composed of what refiners call aviation alkylate, a blend of branched-chain hydrocarbons such as isomers of isooctane which, of themselves, have high octane and good anti-knock characteristics. Refiners add a small dose of tetraethyl lead to boost octane to a bit over 100 to meet the requirements of ASTM fuel spec D-910. Tetraethyl was banned from automotive fuels during the 1980s and there’s pressure to remove it from aviation fuels to achieve new, more stringent air quality standards. Shea explained that Shell is using an aviation alkylate base with a blend of aromatic compounds to deliver a fuel with performance characteristics almost identical to 100LL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WINDYCITYJOHN400 Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 That didn't show up too well. How bout this?…... The problem with the internet is anyone can say anything. If something is passed along and posted enough, everyone starts to believe it.For example, these things have been said about 100LL multiple times.It is only for low-rpm engines with low compression and at high altitude. It has additives for high altitude and burns slower thus killing throttle response.All of these things are simply untrue! AvGas was designed for high-compression, high-performance, high boost turbocharged fighter aircraft like those used in WWII. It's only additives are lead and benzene. Both are the best octane boosters in existence. The avgas octane rating is determined by the MON test, so 100 octane avgas (100LL) would actually be about 106 octane if it were sold at the pump where the average of the MON and RON test were used. (R+M/2) is printed right on the gas pumps if you look. The MON test is a much better test and uses higher RPM's and higher temperatures to determine octane.All this can be proven if you research enough, just don't trust the race fuel retailers. They are salesmen!!!There is a reason no-one comes on here and complains about problems with 100LL. Lots of people come on here complaining about pump gas. There is a reason for that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATVridinMaNiAc Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 All of that crap is just facts about av gas none of it proves what I said is wrong there is multiple additives in av gas. I never said it wouldn't run good in a banshee. Go Google av gas runs dry and removes oil during combustion see if you can find something. And oh my how fun...my banshee is better than your banshee NEENER NEENER. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WINDYCITYJOHN400 Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Regardless of me working on a air mobility base that is also right next to civilian airport and am around this shit constantly. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk FFS Well I live close to a midsize regional airport. I drive past it every day. Sometimes I drive past on the North side... Sometimes I drive past on the South side... Sometimes the West side…. Sometimes I even drive past the West side before driving along the North side…. I even have planes flying over my house from time to time. So I'm "Around this shit constantly" too... Burns dirty? Are you tearing down motors and inspecting them? I'm guessing your looking at the surface of the plane. How clean would your Banshee look running the fuel YOU like if the tailpipes exited in front and you drove thru it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATVridinMaNiAc Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Cool story...I actually work on the base on the planes. I have knowledge to back this up. Unlike you. You may know about a banshee but not about aviation. Lead buildup and other additives are the only reason it runs dirty. Nothing that significant. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sprinklerman Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Regular race gas and AV gas is no where near the same... av gas has high lead content and certain additives for weight and balance purposes of aviation......... just keep in mind that because of alot of additives and the lead it will run in your engine very dirty., All of that crap is just facts about av gas none of it proves what I said is wrong there is multiple additives in av gas. I never said it wouldn't run good in a banshee. Go Google av gas runs dry and removes oil during combustion see if you can find something. And oh my how fun...my banshee is better than your banshee NEENER NEENER. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk Umm... In your 1st post you are quoted as saying it has certain additives for weight and balance purposes. ..( btw you still haven't defined what you ment by that, but alluded to the fact that it's bad for a banshee) 2nd, you said it ran in your engine " very dirty" which is complete BS btw. Why would the aviation use a dirty running , deposit leaving fuel? That..and the fact that I've seen far too many ultra clean 2 strokes torn down thst ran 100ll. Lead is not an enemy of a banshee engine. Sent from a van down by the river Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATVridinMaNiAc Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Not surprised this would catch the attention of thecAlmighty arguer. With a dyno to his defense for every argument. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATVridinMaNiAc Posted February 16, 2014 Report Share Posted February 16, 2014 Umm... In your 1st post you are quoted as saying it has certain additives for weight and balance purposes. ..( btw you still haven't defined what you ment by that, but alluded to the fact that it's bad for a banshee) 2nd, you said it ran in your engine " very dirty" which is complete BS btw. Why would the aviation use a dirty running , deposit leaving fuel? That..and the fact that I've seen far too many ultra clean 2 strokes torn down thst ran 100ll. Lead is not an enemy of a banshee engine. Sent from a van down by the river I never said I ran it in my engine...what the fuck. It runs dirtier but you could say not so much in a bad way.lead buildup. Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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