Thack82 Posted July 27, 2011 Report Share Posted July 27, 2011 Okay guy's I went to Wind Rock OHV to ride with a couple of buddys on there four chokes (400EX, LTZ-400). My Banshee didnt like the altatude change, I had it set for 740ft above sea level and who knows how high we ended up. I adjusted and rejetted the carbs after a quick ride but I was to late. When I got home I broke it down, the rings were wore and the pistons have scoff marks on them near the bottom. It looks like someone took sand paper and scuffed the on the bottom. The wrist pin bearing on the right cylinder is stiff as well, so I figure I need a whole new Wiseco Piston Top End Kit. Do you guys have any sugestions on kits? Is there anything better than Wiseco Pro-Lite Forged Aluminum Pistons? I would love to put Power Valve Cylinders on it for low end grunt, but I can't sink $2,000 to $2,500 into the motor. I race Hare Scrambles from time to time and I trail ride. What would you do or what would you buy to go back in the cylinders? The Cylinders still look okay. My upgrades are listed in my sig... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
n2otoofast4u Posted July 27, 2011 Report Share Posted July 27, 2011 First off, going higher in elevation would have made the bike richer, not leaner. You need to decide what size pistons are in it before you buy new. You will want to have the cylds bored to the next size if they are good or maybe even 2 sizes if they are way out of round or scared real bad. The weisco pistons won't come with bearings so you will need to order those separate. You are best off to send the cylds to a site sponsor to get bored so you know they are done right and buy your pistons, gasket, etc. From them. Support those who support the sport, NOT EBAY! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
06specialedition Posted July 27, 2011 Report Share Posted July 27, 2011 You are best off to send the cylds to a site sponsor to get bored so you know they are done right and buy your pistons, gasket, etc. From them. Support those who support the sport, NOT EBAY! X2...Don't buy a kit on egay. Call a site sponsor on here, you can't go wrong with any of them either way. Wildcard Racing, FAST, HJR, Redline, M&M...etc. I had Wildcard Racing build my bike and I couldn't be happier, Brandon and Shay are top notch people. You have my word you won't be disappointed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrockMoto Posted July 27, 2011 Report Share Posted July 27, 2011 Support those who support the sport, NOT EBAY! word Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thack82 Posted July 27, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 27, 2011 First off, going higher in elevation would have made the bike richer, not leaner. You need to decide what size pistons are in it before you buy new. You will want to have the cylds bored to the next size if they are good or maybe even 2 sizes if they are way out of round or scared real bad. The weisco pistons won't come with bearings so you will need to order those separate. You are best off to send the cylds to a site sponsor to get bored so you know they are done right and buy your pistons, gasket, etc. From them. Support those who support the sport, NOT EBAY! I don't know what caused it to get so hot then, I have every cooling mod made for a Bansheeon it (Trinity Cool Head/20cc Domes, 30% Bigger Aluminum Radiator, CV-4 Radiator Cap, In-Line Billet Coolers, Billet Water Pump, and I run ATV Engine Ice) As good as you guys are modding Banshee's I can't belaeve you of you havent come up with a electric fan/brackets/Aluminum shroud set up that sets behind the radiator and infront of the steering stem to help keep these thing cool. I just figured it was leaning out, because 99% of all the Banshee owners on HQ say they don't have problems. I'm running Keihin 28mm D Slide Carbs with 150 Mains and 52 Pilots, 160's are to much. I run Klotz/93 Octane 32:1. I told Wild Cards I would get with him when my cylinders needed work so thats probibly who I'll let work on them. I went ahead and bought a set of Wiseco Rings and there soaking in Z-MAX. I had my Banshee rebuilt right after I got it, they punched it .020, and I bought a Hot Rods Forged Crank, Wiseco Pro- Lite Pistons and top end. I don't see any other Wiseco Pistons avalable for the Banshee other than the Forged Pro Lites, I didnt know if they made Dome Pistons or any other variation. Whats your guys opionion on Trinitys Power Valve Cylinders for my type of riding (Trail/Hare Scrambles)? Thay say the P.V. set ups give two strokes four stoke charicteristics as far as low end. Any way I'll see what the guys at Wild Cards think, keep the opionions coming. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
252wheelieking Posted July 27, 2011 Report Share Posted July 27, 2011 (edited) I think you are way too lean on the main jet. You should be somewhere around the 155-158 area on the mains. I am at sea level running 158-160's depending on the weather. The 150 is why I think you melted your rings & damaged your top end....JMHO... Far as Trinity I never dealt with them. With all the complaints I heard about them & how shitty there customer service is I will never deal with them. I don't have that kind of money to give them a chance to do me dirty. But to each is own. You can give them a try tho. Good Luck Edited July 27, 2011 by 252wheelieking Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotta_goatsfast Posted July 27, 2011 Report Share Posted July 27, 2011 Time to seriously consider a 4 mil with an mx style port. You'll have more power up top AND way more balls down lower. Get with a reputable site sponsor. The extra stroke and port would be WELL worth the money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thack82 Posted July 28, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 28, 2011 Time to seriously consider a 4 mil with an mx style port. You'll have more power up top AND way more balls down lower. Get with a reputable site sponsor. The extra stroke and port would be WELL worth the money. I should have put a 4mil kit in it the first go around a year an a half ago, I don't know why I didn't I guess I was going on the old out dated idea that the bigger the engine set up the less reliablity.... I should have my ass kicked for buying a Hot Rods Forged Factory Replacment Crank Vs the Hot Rods 4mil Stroker Crank. Oh well... I hate to ge into the bottom end when its in good shape (less than 60hrs of riding time). When I had this motor set up put together I was talking to Gman-7m AKA Luna Racing I bought my Paul Turner Pipes and Fat Boy Silancers off him, he told me then that I needed to go 4mil. I pasted the deal he emailed me off an old email bellow in red. I should have let him put my set up together from what I've seen on You Tube his set ups are awesome. Instead of sending my motor to him I orderd a new Hot Rods Forged Replacment Crank and Rods, and a Wiseco Forged Aluminum Pro-Lite .020 Piston and top end kit off the internet took it to the local Yamaha Dealer "Lee's Yamaha". The whole rebuild including parts was around $1,050.00 and that was just rebuilding my top and bottom end, none of the other things that Gus was going to help me out with were included. Hi Jim,if you can ship me the engine complete, I can build you an awesome trail engine with lots of top end with all the following: New 4mil Hot rods crank and bearings, rebore and chamfer cylinders, new Wiseco forged light weight pistons at 64.5mm, trail port cylinders with auxiliary intake ports and exhaust port timing @ 190* for awesome mid and top end power, port the case to match the transfers to the cylinders, a good used and polished Cool head with domes for race gas or regular fuel, replace all seals and gaskets with new cometic brand, replace any worn bearings and gears on the trans including shift forks, modified shift star with an up graded clutch needle bearing pancake pusher, rebuild your carbs with new kits and install Vito's jetting kits, Install a lightened fly wheel for quicker acceleration, this will be a very reliable engine build with power. Labor, machine work, port and polish work, new parts as described above and shipping one way, $1450.00. Any labor that I perform is guarantied. please call me if interested@ Gus. Thanks, Luna racing..... 252Wheelieking you might be right maybe I am running the jetting to lean, before I ride it again I'm going to step up to 155 Mains. Does anyone know of a aftermarket company that makes a Small CC MonoBlock for the Banshee? I've read that MonoBlocks cool much better than the stock jugs. I would love to find a company that made a Polished Aluminum 350cc MonoBlock, if I had that then my intire motor would be Billet and Chrome. But I don't know if anything like that even exist, if it does will the aftermarket Cool Head's like my Trinity Stage IV, work with it? If I have my stock cylinders ported will it help or hurt my bottom end, I understand that porting helps out mid and top end but I can't see it helping out my low end. Close EDIT: Phone number deleted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotta_goatsfast Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 I understand not wanting to pull a good crank and replace it. If you are interested in a monoblock cylinder, look into the 68mmX54mm serval. It is the same 68mm bore with all the same technology that is in a 68x58 serval, only for use with a stock stroke crank. I built a 421 serval and it really does have a wide and smooth powerband. Its incredibly predictable and very forgiving. It can be lugged down and still pull gear upto and into the powerband and with the right pipes will provide a screaming 10K+ overrev. I spank the 4 strokes at the tracks and cross country courses. From what I understand you ride in similar terrain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gotta_goatsfast Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 I should add that the particular serval I mentioned is 392cc, has more aluminum (much more solid than two single jugs carved out) and a nikasil bore vs. steel sleeves in the oems. And yes, your head will bolt on, the reeds and intake from a stock cylinder will bolt right on, and the pipes will match right up. Good luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thack82 Posted July 29, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 I understand not wanting to pull a good crank and replace it. If you are interested in a monoblock cylinder, look into the 68mmX54mm serval. It is the same 68mm bore with all the same technology that is in a 68x58 serval, only for use with a stock stroke crank. I built a 421 serval and it really does have a wide and smooth powerband. Its incredibly predictable and very forgiving. It can be lugged down and still pull gear upto and into the powerband and with the right pipes will provide a screaming 10K+ overrev. I spank the 4 strokes at the tracks and cross country courses. From what I understand you ride in similar terrain. Yes, I live in central Kentucky. I stay in the woods most of the time on trails, I went a different route when I put my Banshee together. I wanted to build a good handling woods racer that had a ton of low end but would still kick ass and pick up a lot of ground in the straight stretches. I put it together this way because I'm pushing 30 and I planned on running the Kentucky Off Road Hare Scrambles and most of the guys that run those races are teens or early 20's and in a hell of a lot better shape than I am. When I told some of my buddy's that race them religiously that I was going to buy a Banshee and run it in the KORHS against 68 Sport Quads (all 68 are 4 Stroke) they laughed and said the Banshee was old out dated technology that belonged at Sand Drags not in a Hare Scramble. They said a Banshee could not be competitive in woods racing because they ride like shit, they are impossible to keep cool, and they were very unreliable. So I was out to prove them wrong, I built my motor for low end power the best way I new how based on my limited knowledge and internet research. I had the motor built with forged internals and every cooling mod I could find and added Paul Turner Pipes/Fat Boy Silencers, Chariot Billet Reed Cages/Boyesen Power Reeds, Chariot Billet Reed Spacers, Trinity Stage IV Cool Head /20cc Domes, Boot Bottle (I know there a Joke), and a High Flow Ready Air Filter/in stock Air Box with EHS Outerwears lid. I took my Banshee over to a buddy's farm for a trial run after I added a aftermarket/upgraded complete Suspension, New Tires/ITP Wheels, Skid Plates and Guards to try it out. The Power that set up made combined with suspension was great in the woods but the open fields was a different story, the power band was to short. I fixed that buy adding new 15/42 Sprockets and that made a huge difference. But there was still one spot (right after I shifted 4th) in my bike where it didn't pull as hard as I wanted so I added the 28mm Keihin D Slides and it took care of that. I never had any big problems until that trip to Wind Rock my Banshee was way out of its element there I just don't think a Banshee can be a great rock crawler. The 421 Serval your telling me about seems like its just what I need, Will it work well in conjunction with my other upgrades? And where should I start looking to get one at the best price. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thack82 Posted July 29, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 I should add that the particular serval I mentioned is 392cc, has more aluminum (much more solid than two single jugs carved out) and a nikasil bore vs. steel sleeves in the oems. And yes, your head will bolt on, the reeds and intake from a stock cylinder will bolt right on, and the pipes will match right up. Good luck! Thank you so much for your help and input Gotta_Gofast you don't know how helpful you have been. I'm going to start scowering the internet for one now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coryv4 Posted July 29, 2011 Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 Thank you so much for your help and input Gotta_Gofast you don't know how helpful you have been. I'm going to start scowering the internet for one now. one last thing think about it if you really want a stock stroke serval u muight want more power next year but you cant just bolt a 4 mil in with that cylinder it needs machining if you do it its always good to over do it just get the 4mil serval its 400 dollars more i think the 392 serval was 1300 and the 421 4mil serval 1700 threw m&m atv i built a 421 serval and it was like going from a blaster to a banshee all over again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thack82 Posted July 29, 2011 Author Report Share Posted July 29, 2011 Thank you so much for your help and input Gotta_Gofast you don't know how helpful you have been. I'm going to start scowering the internet for one now. Dose Serval make a Small Block Mono Block with Power Valves or would you stay away from them? Who would you go through if I decide to go with the Serval? Have you had any experience with a Twister Mono Block? It doesn't look like I'd be able to use my Trinity Cool Head. Twister Billet Small Block Part: SBC-1 Available from stock stroke to 14mm and everything in between, this cylinder kit is the SUV of the race world...tough, powerful, and truly a do-it-all cylinder! Available in a 69mm bore for the guys who want to just bolt-on and go, and also available with bore sizes up to 75mm for the ultimate in performance! All the porting is done by CNC for the most precise flow and direction of fuel, giving you the edge over the other guys. Another welcomed feature of this cylinder over the other guys is our cast iron sleeves...that's right, no nikasil to deal with and no headaches trying to get your motor back together at the races! The use of bolt-on reedboxes give you the option of retaining your stock reeds or upgrading to the bigger CR 125 reeds for even better performance! Two different exhaust flange sizes are available to either use your factory size pipes or bigger flange race pipes! The interchangability of this cylinder is a really neat deal because if you feel like upgrading sometime down the road, it's a lot easier to expand and adapt to your Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildcardracing Posted July 30, 2011 Report Share Posted July 30, 2011 The best bang for your buck would be a Serval cylinder. They are a monoblock available in stock, +4, +7 and +10 strokes and in 65 and 68 bores. They are made by CP industries and any of the site sponsors who do engines on here can get one for you including myself. The stock stroke aftermarket cylinders aren't economically corrected to stroker setups because they all have too much transfer timing to drop in a longer stroke crank. The powervalved cylinders such as the cheetah and big block twisters do make great torque, but are very pricey. The cheetah requires a little less work to install than the Twister but I think you'll find both topends much out of the pricerange you mentioned. You can do a 421 (4mil) serval complete build for the price of just the trinity or twister top end. Give me a shout if you want to talk a little more on it. -Brandon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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