Whats better a twister cylinder or a super cub?

[papa_smurf49319]

Thats a 10 mill twister in your picture. What is that a 4 or 6 over swing arm? What kind of power do you make to need that long of a swing arm?

 

 

He makes enough lol.

 

 

 

Cody

[locogato11283]

Thats a 10 mill twister in your picture. What is that a 4 or 6 over swing arm? What kind of power do you make to need that long of a swing arm?

 

there are guys with a lot less power than that 10mm twister that run a lot longer swingarms.

[crazycanuck]

very interested in these twister motors, just have a few questions if anyone feels like answerin. do the top ends require you to use a twister crankshaft? or could a guy use a hotrods crank? and what size and make of carbs, and pipes work best with them? thanks!

[J-Madd]

Any make of crankshaft would work. Carbs would depend on your preference. 39 pwks, 41.5 Lectrons, 38(?) Mikunis. All would be fine.

[crazycanuck]

are there any site sponsors that build twisters? or do they only come from TWISTER...

[firebanshee]

are there any site sponsors that build twisters? or do they only come from TWISTER...

Any good motor builder can port twister cylinders, you would just get them from twister. Some builders might have more expierence than others with these cylinders and might know a few tricks that make them work better. I think it just comes down to builder preference.

[Koolguyson]

Why anybody would spend $1500 for an unported twister small block that makes less horsepower than a $900 cub is beyond me.

 

There is nothing that would sell me on a billet other than the "look" of it. The cub is faster, it is cheaper to build. It is cheaper to have somebody port. It is the most universal aftermarket cylinder on the market.

 

You get what you pay for? Billet is expensive. But dollar per hp...you can't beat a cub. Not only that, but a billet small block will never out hp a cub.

 

And no...it doesn't cost 400 to replate a nikasil cylinder.

[BigRed350x]

Thats a 10 mill twister in your picture. What is that a 4 or 6 over swing arm? What kind of power do you make to need that long of a swing arm?

 

Yeah, its a 10mil big block twister. Its a +10 swingarm with an HS Customs hillshooter frame. Firehead dyno-tuned the bike in my sig up in oregon and it made 152hp.

[BigRed350x]

Why anybody would spend $1500 for an unported twister small block that makes less horsepower than a $900 cub is beyond me.

 

There is nothing that would sell me on a billet other than the "look" of it. The cub is faster, it is cheaper to build. It is cheaper to have somebody port. It is the most universal aftermarket cylinder on the market.

 

You get what you pay for? Billet is expensive. But dollar per hp...you can't beat a cub. Not only that, but a billet small block will never out hp a cub.

 

And no...it doesn't cost 400 to replate a nikasil cylinder.

 

Cubs don't have changeable intake manifolds or exhaust flanges. Its cheaper to bore an iron sleeve than to get a cub cylinder re-plated. Down-time for a bore on an iron sleeve is also less than a re-plate. I've owned both, and know first-hand. That's a pretty broad statement that a smallblock will never out hp a cub. Too many variables involved in it to truthfully make that statement. It all comes down to porting and setup. The twister cylinders have better cooling characteristics, better head-stud layout, changeable intakes, changeable exhaust flanges, and iron sleeves. If you can afford the extra coin, the twister cylinders are a very nice investment that offer quite a few benefits over the cub cylinders. JMO.

[Koolguyson]

Cubs don't have changeable intake manifolds or exhaust flanges. Its cheaper to bore an iron sleeve than to get a cub cylinder re-plated. Down-time for a bore on an iron sleeve is also less than a re-plate. I've owned both, and know first-hand. That's a pretty broad statement that a smallblock will never out hp a cub. Too many variables involved in it to truthfully make that statement. It all comes down to porting and setup. The twister cylinders have better cooling characteristics, better head-stud layout, changeable intakes, changeable exhaust flanges, and iron sleeves. If you can afford the extra coin, the twister cylinders are a very nice investment that offer quite a few benefits over the cub cylinders. JMO.

 

What is the benefit of changeable manifolds or exhaust flanges? More junk to buy?

 

It is cheaper to bore an iron sleeve, but you also have to bore them more because they are more prone to sticking. My last nikasil job cost me 180. That is two bores. I didn't even need to nikasil my cylinder, but after two years of racing, I figured I just should (This is on my DMX, not a cub).

 

Twisters have better cooling? How do you prove this? My DMX runs at 105 degrees after a pass, and I don't even have a radiator. Does yours run cooler than that?

[rb0804]

the super cubs require a special head and I believe that they have sealing problems in elevated HP due to cylinder head spacing. I do not have first hand experience with that maybe someone who does will chime in...

[locogato11283]

im with koolguyson on this one.. i dont see the point in spending that kind of money when you can build a cub or maybe even a DM a lot cheaper than this twister setup.

 

also, i am highly skeptical of 152 hp out of a 10mm motor of any kind. is that 152 at the rear wheels? if so, what kind of power would it be making at the crank? and if this motor really makes that kind of power, why isnt everyone running one of them?

 

another question that koolguyson can probably answer for us.. what kind of cylinders do the fastest bikes in the country run? im assuming they are cp industries.

 

also, what size cp industries motor will easily make 150 hp at the rear wheels?

[Koolguyson]

im with koolguyson on this one.. i dont see the point in spending that kind of money when you can build a cub or maybe even a DM a lot cheaper than this twister setup.

 

also, i am highly skeptical of 152 hp out of a 10mm motor of any kind. is that 152 at the rear wheels? if so, what kind of power would it be making at the crank? and if this motor really makes that kind of power, why isnt everyone running one of them?

 

another question that koolguyson can probably answer for us.. what kind of cylinders do the fastest bikes in the country run? im assuming they are cp industries.

 

also, what size cp industries motor will easily make 150 hp at the rear wheels?

 

I true 152hp motor will run low to mid 60's.

 

Nearly every record is held by a cast motor.

 

An 18mm DM will put you over a true 150hp. I know most 18mm big block twisters that fight to get above 155.

 

Please don't get it twisted. Twisters are nice, and they are great people. But dollar per hp, it is second option.

Edited February 22, 2010 by Koolguyson

[BigRed350x]

I don't want to turn this thread into a bunch of bickering back and forth. Both sides are going to be pretty loyal to their own group. I said at the end of my last post that it was JMO. That's all it is, is just my opinion.

 

Loco, you'd have to talk to Mark (firehead) about the numbers he got out of my setup. He did the cylinders himself and tuned them in-house. I believe it was RWHP, but he does have engine dyno's. I guess if the numbers are that big of an issue you could ask him about it. I usually ride at 7000ft or higher, so it obviously wouldn't be that high where I ride.

 

I think the fasest cylinders are in the laydown bikes, and I have no clue what kinda engines those monsters even run. ...and they run nitromethane if I'm not mistaken, so its not really comparable. We were talking about small block twisters and cubs, you're taking it out of perspective.

 

The changeable intakes and exhaust flanges simply offer more versatility to custom suite your setup. They are not "more junk to buy" they come with the small block setup. You just have to let them know which ones you want when you order. If you want to keep your old reeds, intakes and small bore pipes, then you can do that. If you want to try and get every last little umph out of it, then you could go with the larger intakes and big bore flanges. Its just options you can have with the choice of the small block, and from the factory. Can you order a cub with big bore flanges and larger intakes? No. You'd have to go with the cheetah, which is a lot more expensive than the twister small block. (but it does have the option for powervalves, which the twister does not)

 

The small block twister does have superior cooling characteristics and flow through the head than the cub cylinder. Bringing a DMX or even a DM cylinder into the conversation is a whole different ball-game. You're talking some huge cylinders, which would be better compared to a big block twister. I thought we were just comparing the small block to the cub, super cub and maybe the cheetah. Also, bringing engine temps after a single pass into the conversation doesn't give much grounds for comparison. I was simply looking at the small block vs the cub. The small block twister offers higher coolant capacity, and a head that accomodates larger volume flow. If you don't believe me, purchase a flow bench and do some tests. Firehead already has, and the twisters offer better cooling characteristics than a cub or supercub. I'm not sure about the cheetah though, they have a different head design and different heat passage layout. I'd also be willing to guess that if you run a DMX that you run alky or methanol or methylalchohol, which would have a drastic effect on your engine temps.

 

I will leave it at this, and let anyone reading this form their own opinion. I don't want a good useful topic like this to turn into a few people just going back and forth and taking away from the good technical information that's been presented (FROM BOTH SIDES). I'm a billet cylinder guy and you guys are cast cylinder guys. They both have benefits, and I've seen both cylinder designs perform exceptionally well. In the end it all comes down to who you do your porting, and the rest of your engine setup.

 

If you have fun with what you have and you enjoy it, then I'd say you got your money's worth. For me, its fun to have one of the cylinder designs that isn't so main-stream. Plus they just look cool. IMO. Its all a money game. If you're happy with what you spend your money on, great! The variety of the parts available for these bikes is what makes our corner of the ATV market so much fun.

 

- Jared

[BigRed350x]

I true 152hp motor will run low to mid 60's.

 

Nearly every record is held by a cast motor.

 

An 18mm DM will put you over a true 150hp. I know most 18mm big block twisters that fight to get above 155.

 

Please don't get it twisted. Twisters are nice, and they are great people. But dollar per hp, it is second option.

 

I was told that my engine setup ran a 3.7?s 300ft in oregon when firehead had it up there. You would have to ask him to verify this though, since it wasn't me who ran it. I saw a guy on planetsand who had a 14mil small block that ran a few 3.8's, so I would think it wouldn't be too far fetched to get a big block (bigger bore) 10mil to do some numbers close to that. I'm not sure. We just race with friends out on the dunes and at sand mountain. Two different worlds. If I make it to the top of sand mountain without sucking my bowls dry or having a pump fail I'm happy. haha!