Coupelx Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 (edited) about the over rev? last time i checked over-rev was just that, taking the motor out of its normal operating range. the last time i did it with a car i broke alot of shit in the top end. a motor that is capable of making more topend power could potientially be able to over-rev easier. Edited March 26, 2009 by Coupelx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kwalt21 Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 I put a boost bottle on and it revd over 14k :biggrin: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blowit Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 I understand what he is saying but some other things must be considered. Over rev can be designed into an engine to effectively rev past peak power without falling flat. It is very common for closed course race bikes because there are times when grabbing another gear is not advantageous. Over rev is not super important (IMO) for drag racing since one can tune and re gear to stay in the sweet spot. MAX RPM - mechanical limit or usable???? Mechanical - somewhere around 20K RPM. The longer the stroke and less the rod length, the less the mechanical limit. Usable - depending on setup but most bikes will not exceed 11K at peak power with decent over rev of 12K. Most dyno operators shut the dyno down after power starts falling off. An inertial dyno will show over rev but it gets hard on a brake dyno. There are ways to design in over rev. Most of the time it is using an exhaust that is tuned for higher rpm operation than the engine. This seems to flatten the peak power band and the pipe helps the engine along once max designed engine rpm is reached. Brandon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopczynski Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 I am thinking that over rev is going to have to be classified as usable power range, which its still not at the rpm's he is trying to justify. I cant think of anyone thats building a twin cylinder banshee motor thats actually pulling 14k rpm in a mx race, drag race, or play bike. I ride with Patriot Racing, twister, Rooster, Trinity, ILR, Redline, and RSR bikes. I even ride with some of the owners of those companies themselves. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolguyson Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 Not sure what happened w/the quote??? No smartass either, just calling BS! Snop, what I meant was your numbers are accurate IMO. I am waiting for the Koolguy details so I too can increase my usable HP in the upper rpm range with more over-rev :biggrin: I am assuming my combustion is screwed up since my current bike makes no where near 11,000 rpm in the real world and my HP an torque dop like a rock in over-rev not long after making max HP. Short of that, I would like whatever drugs Koolguy is using :happy: This is overrev. Tough concept I know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koolguyson Posted March 26, 2009 Report Share Posted March 26, 2009 I understand what he is saying but some other things must be considered. Over rev can be designed into an engine to effectively rev past peak power without falling flat. It is very common for closed course race bikes because there are times when grabbing another gear is not advantageous. Over rev is not super important (IMO) for drag racing since one can tune and re gear to stay in the sweet spot. Brandon Brandon, overrev is actually very important in drag racing. The more overrev a motor has, the more forgiving it is when you mistime your shift. If your bike falls out of its effective power range, even if it is for .1 of a second, that is a .1+ lost on your ET. By widening your overrev, it not only helps insure that you will hit your shift, but also prolongs the time your motor can stay in the power. I am on drugs? I never said anything about 14k being the norm, but you should be able to hit 11k fairly easy. Gee, maybe I will put my clapped out bike up against yours. How fast have you gone again? I'll keep my thoughts to myself. I forgot you guys are "experts". (not directed to Brandon) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopczynski Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Are you sure you know what over rev is? Fall=Down. If your drag racing, mis-time a shift and the power falls out of the effective range, well thats when you need torque backup. If you miss a shift and go over your shift point, then your in over rev. I know every motor has it, and it can be extenede out to even SLIGHTLY higher rpm's than 11k-11.5k! I just dont believe the numbers your claiming upwards of 12.5K-14K rpm. You said you got proof, lets see it. Cause I got lots of it too, and I already posted some dyno sheets for some RDZ drag bikes on the first page. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopczynski Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 This is a copy and paste of a pm I got from Koolguyson: "I hope you can understand, but my bike right now currently holds the ET record for my 775 and under class. I can't post up my dyno sheets. Part of racing is that you can't let the other guys know what you have. Especially 3 weeks before the big race." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blowit Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 This is a copy and paste of a pm I got from Koolguyson: "I hope you can understand, but my bike right now currently holds the ET record for my 775 and under class. I can't post up my dyno sheets. Part of racing is that you can't let the other guys know what you have. Especially 3 weeks before the big race." Seems a little rude if you ask me Snop What is a dyno sheet going to ultimately prove in this sword fight anyway? B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
locogato11283 Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 koolguy, i see you been coming over to HQ more and more here lately.. whats the deal? did PS ban you or just piss you off? you finally realize ohton is a crooked ass piece of shit and say fuck his site? anyway, carry on! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grizzly700 Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 Seems a little rude if you ask me Snop What is a dyno sheet going to ultimately prove in this sword fight anyway? B i would like to see koolguyson dyno sheets. he is claiming he can make power out to 14k then he should back up his claims and show us his dyno sheets. wat was his record neway? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopczynski Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 Seems a little rude if you ask me Snop What is a dyno sheet going to ultimately prove in this sword fight anyway? B How is it rude, if he stated he had proof of it, then I asked to see it? The dyno sheet would prove he had either a big bore turning 12k-13k, or a small bore turning 14K. Although not impossible, but highly unlikely without some seriously expensive and smart work, then some good parts. He spouted off, that if you weren't turning the kind of rpm's he was turning, then you had something setup wrong with your bike. I say BS, I ride with plenty of fast drag bikes that dont turn those kind of rpm's. I find it highly unlikely that there is a strong majority of drag bikes out there turning those rpm's on drag passes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blowit Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 How is it rude, if he stated he had proof of it, then I asked to see it? The dyno sheet would prove he had either a big bore turning 12k-13k, or a small bore turning 14K. Although not impossible, but highly unlikely without some seriously expensive and smart work, then some good parts. He spouted off, that if you weren't turning the kind of rpm's he was turning, then you had something setup wrong with your bike. I say BS, I ride with plenty of fast drag bikes that dont turn those kind of rpm's. I find it highly unlikely that there is a strong majority of drag bikes out there turning those rpm's on drag passes. I am just referring to bringing his PM ("personal" message) into the forum. It was obvious his intent was to keep the comment more personal. I am not going to comment on the dyno sheet. B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snopczynski Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 I am just referring to bringing his PM ("personal" message) into the forum. It was obvious his intent was to keep the comment more personal. I am not going to comment on the dyno sheet. B Duley Noted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dajogejr Posted March 28, 2009 Report Share Posted March 28, 2009 I'd bet he'll post it after Gilbert. Give him a break for now guys...it is a big race, there is a lot of money involved... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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