SlowerThanYou

My suggestion is to talk to the track owner/manager 1st before building anything. Most, but not all sanctioned tracks will require a stock frame. Last I knew IHRA even had written into their rules requiring nerf bars. Outlaw tracks seem to let about anything run. Before we go to any new track, we always call first. A good many don't even welcome you to run & some have limitations on when you can run.

He seems to be well ahead in all tuning categories. LOL! We don't tune our clutch from pass to pass on the hill, 300' or asphalt.

I'm sure the power to weight ratio is a big factor, but I'm sure that's not the only one he's focusing on. After having some conversations with him, he's well ahead of the vast majority in clutch tuning department also.

I can't wait to hear from all the 1/4 mile experts.

We are going back to the basics & hopefully I can explain things a little clearer this time. IMO, the Baseline tune-up is the single most important step/start in setting up the lock-up. It doesn't matter if you think your baseline is correct/not correct or even if it's your 1st time using a lock-up. It’s a known reference to make changes from, if the change(s) don’t work go back to your baseline. If something works it becomes part of your new baseline. Baseline: Spring installed height, spring pressure @ the installed height, arm weight, clutch stack height & air gap measurement.

I'm glad the debate ended well.

LOL! the good old HQ Circus debate. We have agreed aerodynamics play a part, but I think it's one of the bigger parts. You hit on one of the factors, power to weight ratio. I did the ratio for our drag car & the quad not much of a difference. Car, total weight 3080 lbs. divided by 630 hp = 1 hp for 4.88 lbs. Quad, total weight 500 lbs. divided by 97 hp = 1 hp for 5.15 lbs. You last sentence I totally agree, along with adding aerodynamics. We have ran at Bonneville Salt Flats a few times.

I agree MPH show the hp of the vehicle, but there are some other factors that play a role. Here's something to throw in for debate. Take your reasoning that a quad has lower mph over cars is simply because of HP. Lets take a stock Suzuki Hayabusa for an example. It has around 450 less hp than our 133-134 mph drag car. With a 180-200 lb. average skill rider will run low 10s @ the same mph or higher than our drag car.

I forgot to add, that we built a 643cc DMX to run 1/4 mile. We had a testing accident at the airport in Mar of this year. The motor was put into a rigid sand chassis & has only ran 300' this year. Next year we plan on putting back into the stock asphalt chassis & running 1/4 mile hopefully around Apr.

I'm not trying to discourage, just trying to give a realistic picture. I don't speak for Tedder, but I'm willing to share some basic info out in the open forum. If I had to do everything over again, I would probably start with our current basic chassis set-up & a 10mm Cub on race gas. MPH is one of the problems with running quads in the quarter mile. Anywhere from 123 - 128 mph is what we see. The mph doesn't correlate like it does with a drag car. I'm pretty sure it has to do with shitty aerodynamics. Our slowest drag car ran numerous 10.06s @ 133-134 mph with a best 60' of 1.40. For the quad to run a 9 without the higher mph you need a 60' min. in the range of 1.30-1.36.

Here's a little back ground on our asphalt history. While it doesn't compare to Dan's impressive runs. I do remember seeing him struggle in his early days on asphalt. It takes time to gain the experience you need to run 1/4 mile. 2005 we built a stock frame, stock cylinder, 7mm, 1-5 override, 417cc 1/4 mile quad. Our 1st 2 passes was a 12.30 & a 12.06. We toasted the clutch in 2 runs. With 3 more times to the track we were running mid 11s with a best of 11.59. Fast forward to our last 7 runs of the year. We switched to alky & a 1-4 manual 5&6 override. After toasting plenty of clutches, not knowing shit about alky & having scary rides clutching the 2 high gears. We managed a best of 11.38 within 37 runs of our 1st year. 2006 same combo as we left off. Around 77 runs into the season we ran our 1st 10 @ 10.95. After much carnage, toasted clutches & blew 2 motors up. The stock cylinder came back to life as a 443cc stock cylinder & we bought a cub cylinder 443cc. Our best times we in the 10.80s with the Cub cylinders. 2007 running the cub cylinders, 443cc. Not a great year & not any improvement from 06. We was doing a lot of testing 2008 same combo as last year, but went back to race gas. This was a one of our best years for performance. Even though we switched back to race gas. We started out running 10.80s. We bought another set of cub cylinders done by Wicked Motorsports. We ran our best time of 10.23. 2009 we decided to go hill shooting. LOL! 4th trip out, I had a major accident. Was out of service for about a year & a half. Feb, 2010 I started building a new chassis set-up to help with my recovery. We didn't change the motor combo, but totally changed the stock chassis set-up. I could tell this set-up was going to be much faster than the old chassis. This was one of our best years period for performance. My 1st pass (Sept.) on the quad since the accident. My 1st pass was an ill mannered run that netted one of our best times at our track. Then I settled in & ran our best pass at our track of 10.39. Our track is typically an easy .3 - .4 slower than the lower elevation tracks most run at. Tedder & I have pretty much followed the same path of performance capabilities. If I remember right he had just ran his 1st 9 sec. run Sept. In Oct. after some impressive 1/8 testing & getting kicked out of a track. We decided to run the best track available & got our 1st 9 sec. runs. Maybe that will give you a small picture of what it takes for 2 normal or un-normal Joe's to run fast in the 1/4. I have around 800-900 1/4 mile passes. I'm sure Tedder has many more than that with 3 quads.

I'm basing that on little to no asphalt experience. 1/8 mile is hard enough, but add another 660'. You had better have a big wallet & lots of patience!

LOL! IMO, the best advice I can give. Cut your teeth on the 1/8 mile, smaller motor, stock frame & no spray. That's based on what your experience level is on asphalt.

LOL! One did & the other is Tedder.

As far as I know, there are 2 member's on here that have ran in the 9's. One is a stock frame, 421 on alky & the other is a stock frame 443 on race gas. I would start with studying them 2 set-ups, just my OPINION!

It would be nice to have a little bit of explanation with these comments. Have any of you ran their 300' races? All I'm looking for is some decent track time at a good track; Dome Valley can provide that. What I'm worried about is this the Promoter's first 300' race & seems like the 2 strokes were added as a last minute thought.

Anyone familiar with the FSA. They seem to have a good following/races on the hills out West. If I'm not mistaken this is their 1st event doing/promoting 300' drags. Seems like they added the 2 stroke classes last minute. Any information would be appreciated.

Nothing against your buddy, but my drag bike bud's learned along with me. A motorcycle set-up & 2-stroke set-up are two different animals. Please don't take any of this in the wrong way, it's my opinion on Banshee clutch tuning.

We have ran with less than 6 springs. 4 or 3 springs seems to give decent/equal pressure across the clutch pack. I still stand by using all 6 springs to get the base pressure total right.

The basket driven lock-up vs. the inner hub driven lock-up are two different set-ups. The basics are similar on most of the adjustments, but different in the application of using it.

You got the basket driven one correct? I don't recommend taking springs out to adjust base pressure.

Just my opinion, but running 5 springs is not the proper way to running that clutch; but what do I know.

I'm sure no one said that or even implied that. Most of this thread has good advice. It may require a combination of these suggestions by the quad owner/tuner to make it work correctly.

Strutting will help slow down the pitch rotation. That's why there's rigid chassis, tailored to the power of the motor being installed. The more power, generally the longer the chassis & vice versa for less power. "Pitch Rotation" "Simply stated, pitch rotation is the technical term for weight transfer. It is beneficial to have sufficient pitch rotation to help hook, but excessive weight transfer can cause giant wheel stands" As for your last question. IMO, that's playing a big factor. That's why we use a launch limiter on our drag vehicles to eliminate that variable.

I'm sure someone will be able to tell you the specific year & models. I think you are in the neighbor hood with your info.