sredish

the passion cylinders I have run DAMN hard.... and smooth to boot.

and comfortably wear shorts with no concenr.

damn.

No on the pro circuits. get off your butt and test them for yourself... c'mon man, don't be lazy.

for duning, PT High Revs, no question. If your going to drag 80% of the time, then maybe some Shearers or CPIs, otherwise, the PTs will get you some great midrange and pull on the top end and be extremely smooth and make the bike more enjoyable to dune.

with ported cylinders and top end pipes, possibly in the upper rpms. non ported cylinders, they're won't be enough flow to take advantage. based on the mods in your sig, they should suit you well; i'm personally a fan of the VF2 reeds, I like them, think they're strong and flow well.

we both agree on this one and i do intend on trying a set of duals at some point for the shit of it but i've been there before. as for lectrons, i like them a lot but they come on a little too quick for my taste, meaning 0 to WOT.

yea, that's mostly what it is. you can only do so much with inertia dynos. i've spent many hours on them and they're great tools for certain things but no alternative for the real thing.

wouldn't let me edit again: this is purely civil and a sort of fun discussion and may not belong in this thread; i don't want to turn this into i've been doing this longer than you or not, because i'm sure we've both been running them forever and I agree with you on some level with the low/mid velocity issue but I also believe it can be tuned to over come with proper porting, jetting and pipes, which all have to do with the velocities and matching of the engine's dynamics. if you're running CPIs, Shearers and so on building a true drag specific stretched bike, then i agree that duals are the way to go and the carb could hold your top end back but the top end limit is lower with a Toomey/PT High type of non-drag top end pipe and I don't believe it holds you back and my bike was revving very well with the 38mm.

I was waiting for your response..... i hear you and I could be wrong on some levels but dynos don't show the whole truth, just part. on our hondas, when we first started setting up dune/drag setups.... we went from the stock POS to the FCR carbs... on a dyno, there weren't any gains and after modding them some still wasn't much if any gains, showed to be not worth the cost and effort on the dyno. but, on the sand/dirt/wherever, they were faster and the response was highly noticeable. that's just one example and there are many. dynos are great tools but you can only take them so far then you have to go with real world experiences. I've done the duals, the singles and all of them back and forth and the single works for me. i used to live and die by the dyno and i rarely get on anymore, just for some prelim tuning and that's it. taking my real world experience, my single carbed stock bore/stroke bike was more than holding it's own against several higher modified banshees, and they all probably made more hp than mine but they were looking at my tail lights; that's good enough for me.

when you're done playing with the duals, grab a single 38mm PWK... good duner setup.

just wanted to follow up. the 7 paddles worked great. front end was very light, probably couldn't have handled much more w/o a swingarm. bike handled them fine and could use more paddle, some 9s would really work well. I also wonder about some 22" 8 paddles instead of 21" 9 paddles.... but with the stock swingarm, i don't think any more paddle than 8 extremes would be doable. i was considering a +2 or maybe a +4 swinger and some 8 or 9 paddles, but i like to trail the bike to, so not sure if a +4 is beneficial to me and not sure how much faster the bike will be with a+2 or +4 and 8 or 9 paddles.... or whether to stay at 21" or move to 22"? anyone care to advise me on that?

oh, ok. sounded like your flywheel and clutch both came from direct drive. dunno, my top end is kickin with that setting. i have better midrange as well and it pulls out of the midrange better. but i might play with it some more, try it again and see.....

I had the flywheel on my last bike lightened and i definitely would like to get another. you got yours from direct drive? try +6 or +7 on the timing, there's a noticeable feel between +7 and +4. Also, rm stator, can you explain that a little, where are you getting that? I'm also wondering how the bike would do with a +2 or +4 swingarm and a little more paddle. This bike needs to maintain some trail-ability some as well, so can't go too long.

I like the 2s better personally, run those.

yea, might be rich.... opening the throttle is like letting more air through leaning it a little.

if you don't need the choke to start a cold motor, you're too rich. if you need the choke to start a warm motor, then you're too lean. 52 sounds a tad high to me.

Just wanted to throw on here that I had the banshee out at Little Sahara this past weekend. Passion aggressive dune ported cylinders, VForce 2 reeds into the 38mm pwk and a pod, milled head for 93 pump, with Paul Turner High Revs and 6.5* advanced timing. Have always used the 35mm and wanted to try a 38mm for better top end but was worried about the low and midrange. I'd have to say that this carb fits the dune port and high rev pipes perfectly. Had enough low /mid to cruise, upper mid was strong and was able to pull out easily into the power. The power hit very strong and revved out good, not as high as CPIs / Shearers obviously but revved out well; handled itself well against other bikes. Very very pleased with the 38mm. Ended up with a 200 main and EEK needle on the 4th. Point of this build is to have a low-key simple bike that runs much harder than someone would first think, kinda sleeper-ish and so far it fits the build. Might put a +2 swinger on it but not sure if the bike will benefit. The triple buff 21" 7 paddle extremes worked very well on this bike also, seemed to be the right paddle given the stock swinger; front end lift was an issue but easily overcome. Some 8 paddles would be ideal I think but may need the swinger. not sure what else to do to get another little bit of power out either... racking my brain on what i may be missing.

does it happen only at WOT or is it bogging at 3/4 then clearing out when you hit WOT? if its happening in the higher gears, that tells me that it's leaning out. see, the higher the gear you get into, the more load you put on the bike. if it's not leaning out until 5th or 6th, then the extra load is needing more fuel and it's bogging out because it's not getting it. if it was super rich, it wouldn't run as good in the lower gears.... 195 sounds a little rich to have no porting done, but it is what it is. get back to us with the needle. if it's bogging at 3/4 throttle then opening up, sounds like a needle issue. if it's only WOT, then you'll have to try a 200 or something. as far as jet sizes, it's not very often but sometimes you come across a bike that needs a little bigger jet then others. my '01 bike was like that. most people were running 165s - 175s, I was running a 195/200 and when I ported, I went to 230 and it was still lean.... i got a much richer needle and it backed off to 210 but it always like the big jets. so if everything else is fine, go with it for now.

it's no problem. the reason I say 'it's possible' is because I don't know what else you have on your bike, if your filter's dirty or other things. you'd be amazed what some people miss or look over. so, yes, your bike will be pulling more air with every stroke (makes you think it should lean out right?) but with the extra air comes velocity and vacuum. the vacuum is what makes a carb work, no vacuum, no fuel period. more vacuum means more fuel and now your motor is pulling more fuel than it needs, causing you to have to jet down a little. but...... check your air filter to. :biggrin:

Did you not see my response above? Your getting more air velocity and vacuum with every stroke, pulling more fuel than before causing a rich condition.

what's the ground clearance.... i will say that there is a benefit to lower ground clearance.... there's in ideal range that I like to stay within.

exactly, this kind of comes back to buying pipes based on what your ride style is, not what you heard that sounds cool..... cpi's have a cool sound but they're by no means a trail pipe.

get you a single 35 or to save money, keep your stock carbs, keep your pipes and then with some spare cash, get your cylinders ported.... then you'll be flying.

again, you need to tell us what kind of riding you do, trail, dune, drag, mx, and so on. In all honesty, going to bigger dual carbs is not something I recommend on a stock port motor, and honestly, I don't really recommend anything larger than 28mm or 30mm carbs unless the person drag races... on a stock bore/stroke motor, 28mm will do whatever you need. And for that matter, you can have the stockers bored out to 28mm a lot cheaper than buying a pair. i still say go with a single carb.... unless you are going to be duning/dragging only.