BenBB Posted April 9, 2007 Report Share Posted April 9, 2007 A big thanks to Mullet Man for the huge thread & how-to on doing YFZ450 a-arms (IS IT PINNED YET?!). I'm doing both my son's '01 and my own '96, last year I broke both OEM Banshee spindles and thought I'd upgrade to the YFZ450's cast aluminum units with a pressed-in steel shaft...hopefully along with 4+1 offset rims as well to reduce spindle fatigue/stress (thanks camatv for the tip). Thing is, the angles are different where the upper a-arm balljoints meet the spindle, and I finally got around to doing the measurements (broke my Dremel, house got broke in and all my computers & guns stolen, blah blah blah, cry me a river heh). Anyway check this out, the travel & extended length is much different between spindles... I know these aren't super accurate but you can get the jist of it, I used a tape measure held down with a couple 2x4's at ground level, and threw it up over the garage door opener rail since I don't have three hands. I also got both quads as close as I could to the same height (for reference both are wearing 21" Holeshot HD's on back with stock swingarms and stock rear shocks), by measuring from ground level to the center of the lower bumper mount bolt. Here's mine: And Brandon's: Here's a wide shot (disregard the tape measure numbers because I'm not level with it) of the tape and both suspensions extended: And a closer shot at the right angle of both suspensions extended: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenBB Posted April 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2007 Now Brandon's '01 with Banshee spindles closer, suspension extended (after which I decided to rig up the tape because I couldn't hold the tape, the cam, and lift the suspension up): Closeup of Brandon's at full extension (hub center at 13"): Wide shot of Brandon's with the suspension compressed fully: And finally a closeup at full compression (tape reads 20" at the hub center, so a potential 7" of travel): Now here's a wide shot of mine at full compression (tape reads around the same 20", just a hair more maybe 20.5"): And finally a closeup of mine at full compression: Going back to the fifth pic of mine at full compression, the tape reads around 10" (maybe 9.5") at full extension, so there's a potential for 10"+ of wheel travel there...BUT I haven't got shocks for either one yet so I have not idea how they will work. I still lack a little work before I can properly measure full compression or bump, namely getting my spindle back on the LH side and Brandon's RH lower a-arm mounted (need another Dremel to hog out two of the little grease seal things), following this "custom shock" measurement page I got from Works: Anyway another thing I noticed about the two setups is that as you cycle the suspension upwards, Brandon's with the Banshee spindles toes in steadily from full extension to full bump, I shoulda tried to measure it but didn't think about it. Mine on the other hand with YFZ450 spindles doesn't toe in at all (or much visibly) until the top third or so of the travel. Also, at full extension I can move Brandon's bars left and right and at full extension the arms don't rise or fall...but on mine at full extension the outer a-arm (the RH arm if you turn the bars Left) rises 3/4" at full steering lock. Strange :shrug: One more thing, I measured from shock mounting bolt eye to eye at full extension on both of 'em, and here's what I got: Brandon's with Banshee spindles 16-3/8" Mine with YFZ450 spindles 17-3/8" without the bars turned, 16-5/8" on the outside arm when turned Anybody that can shed some light here? I'm gonna get to work modelling the YFZ450 spindle in 3D CAD for the front frame reconstruction thread, thought I'd show ya's what I found so far... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rebelbanshee2 Posted April 10, 2007 Report Share Posted April 10, 2007 i bet the angle of the ball joints on the yfz arms is made to work witht the angle on the spindles. using the banshee spindles causes them to bind prematurely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenBB Posted April 10, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2007 i bet the angle of the ball joints on the yfz arms is made to work witht the angle on the spindles. using the banshee spindles causes them to bind prematurely. That's what I'm thinkin'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenBB Posted April 10, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2007 EDIT: It's the INSIDE a-arm that rises when you turn to full lock: turn the bars left and the LH a-arm rises slightly, turn right and the RH arm raises; not such a bad thing perhaps, not sure... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mullet Man Posted April 10, 2007 Report Share Posted April 10, 2007 hey Ben, great post! :thumbsup: have you installed the YFZ shocks on either setup with out the springs on them? i think but not sure here, that this would give the most accurate number for suspension travel. great info, i am a dumby when it comes to this stuff, so hopefully this ends up with some informative input on whats what. :thumbsup: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenBB Posted April 10, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2007 DDQ were you running stock offset rims? Like 3+2 I think is what they are...which is what we've got but I'm hoping to go to 4+1 eventually. And I'm tryin' to find another pair of YFZ spindles now, think I'll go with shocks for those on both Banshees... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shee-Male Posted April 12, 2007 Report Share Posted April 12, 2007 Great info Ben, I often wondered if the 450 spindles would work, I also wonder how or if Raptor spindles would work, they are also aluminum. :shrug: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenBB Posted April 12, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2007 Great info Ben, I often wondered if the 450 spindles would work, I also wonder how or if Raptor spindles would work, they are also aluminum. :shrug: I haven't even looked at Raptor spindles, I wonder if they are the same... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4stroker Posted April 13, 2007 Report Share Posted April 13, 2007 can the banshee spindles be modified so that the ball joints dont bind? what would that involve do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
okbeast Posted April 13, 2007 Report Share Posted April 13, 2007 can the banshee spindles be modified so that the ball joints dont bind? what would that involve do you think? Banshee spindles are cast iron I believe so they don't exactly bend easily (althought my buddies seems to have and we're stumped why). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003LimitedBanshee Posted April 16, 2007 Report Share Posted April 16, 2007 Correct me if I'm wrong and I hope I'm not because I placed a bid on some spindles before asking this question... horse before the carriage? Anyway, the hub/rotor/caliper assembly is the same correct? Like I said, I found a set of the bare spindles, no hub etc. but as long as I can switch my other hardware over then I'm good. Otherwise I need to hope that someone outbids me... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SAVAGE420 Posted April 16, 2007 Report Share Posted April 16, 2007 Correct me if I'm wrong and I hope I'm not because I placed a bid on some spindles before asking this question... horse before the carriage? Anyway, the hub/rotor/caliper assembly is the same correct? Like I said, I found a set of the bare spindles, no hub etc. but as long as I can switch my other hardware over then I'm good. Otherwise I need to hope that someone outbids me... Im not sure but just retract your bid to be safe. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenBB Posted April 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted April 16, 2007 Correct me if I'm wrong and I hope I'm not because I placed a bid on some spindles before asking this question... horse before the carriage? Anyway, the hub/rotor/caliper assembly is the same correct? Like I said, I found a set of the bare spindles, no hub etc. but as long as I can switch my other hardware over then I'm good. Otherwise I need to hope that someone outbids me... Yes it's the same hub & rotor, and the calipers on the YFZ are 2-piston instead of 1. Get 'em. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2003LimitedBanshee Posted April 16, 2007 Report Share Posted April 16, 2007 Yes it's the same hub & rotor, and the calipers on the YFZ are 2-piston instead of 1. Get 'em. Great! I was eyeing your pictures Ben and I was pretty sure they looked exactly the same, but you know how pictures can be. Unfortunatley my bid only covers the spindles and not the calipers etc. However, I only ride the sand so the twin piston calipers aren't AS big a concern for me. Don't get me wron, they would be really nice, but mainly I want the spindles. Wish me luck! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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