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Whats better a twister cylinder or a super cub?


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#1 Pedro

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 06:16 PM

I am in the process of either buying a twister cylinder block or a super cub for my 7mil. I need some help choosing which one is better and which one makes more power. I know one is steel sleaved and the other is nikasil But I want to know more. Any help would be great.

#2 locogato11283

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 07:36 PM

are you starting from scratch or what? why a 7mm motor?

#3 96 sandshee

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 08:20 PM

Why not a 68mm cub drag ported on alky? Nearly 120 horse bolt together motor besides some trenching

#4 Pedro

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 08:26 PM

Why not a 68mm cub drag ported on alky? Nearly 120 horse bolt together motor besides some trenching


I have a 7mil bottom end with the cases trenched and opened for 72-77mm pistons so I wanted to know which one is better?

#5 bansheesandrider

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 08:51 PM

I don't know which one will make more or better power. But the Super Cub is a Nikasil cylinder whish means if the bore gets screwed up you will have to send it out to be recoated to the cost of about $400 for both holes. The Twister cylinder is an iron sleeve which can be bored out when it gets damaged and it will only cost about $80-$100 for the bore job. Some will argue that the Nikasil is harder and less likely to get damaged, but sooner or later it will get damaged and you can bore the Twister 4-5 times for the same money as once on the Nikasil. This is just my opinion and most guys on here will still say a Nikasil cylinder is better, wether it is because they run harder or they just prefer the Nikasil over boring iron sleeves.

#6 jbooker82

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 08:58 PM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nikasil

Nikasil is a trademarked electrodeposited lipophilic nickel matrix silicon carbide coating for engine components, mainly piston engine cylinder liners. It was introduced by Mahle in 1967, initially developed to allow rotary engine apex seals (NSU Ro80 and C111) to work directly against the aluminum housing. This coating allowed aluminum cylinders and pistons to work directly against each other with low wear and friction. Unlike other methods, including cast iron cylinder liners, Nikasil allowed very large cylinder bores with tight tolerances and thus allowed existing engine designs to be expanded easily, the aluminium cylinders also gave a much better heat conductivity than cast iron liners, which is an important factor for a high output engine. The coating was further developed by US Chrome Corporation in the USA in the early 1990s (under the trade name of "Nicom"), as a replacement for hard-chrome plated cylinder bores for Mecury Marine Racing, Kohler Engines, and as a repair replacement for factory-chromed snowmobiles, dirt bikes, ATVs, watercraft and automotive V8 liners/bores.

Porsche started using this on the 1970 917 race car, and later on the 1973 911 RS. Porsche also used it on production cars, but for a short time switched to Alusil due to cost savings for their base 911. Nikasil cylinders were always used for the 911 Turbo and RS models. Nikasil coated aluminum cylinders allowed Porsche to build air-cooled engines that had the highest specific output of any engine of their time. Nikasil is still used in today's 911s with great success.

Nikasil was very popular in the 1990s. It was used by companies such as BMW, Ferrari and Jaguar Cars in their new engine families. However, the sulfur found in much of the world's low quality gasoline caused some Nikasil cylinders to break down over time [1], causing costly engine failures.

Nikasil or similar coatings under other trademarks are also still widely used in racing engines, including those used in Formula One and ChampCar. Suzuki currently uses a race-proven nickel phosphorus-silicon-carbide proprietary coating trademarked SCEM (Suzuki Composite Electro-chemical Material) to maximize cylinder size and improve heat dissipation, e.g., on the engine of the Suzuki_TL1000S and Suzuki DL650 V-Strom and Hayabusa motorcycles [1].




#7 locogato11283

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 09:07 PM

i know it takes a lot less work to get the cub motors to run hard. the twister cylinders require a lot more porting and not everyone can build them to get the most power from them.

i would go with a cheetah cylinder.

#8 BigRed350x

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 10:11 PM

Twister cylinder gets my vote. Everyone and their brother has a cub. Simple fact, as loco said, the cubs take a lot less knowledge and setup experience to make them run right. Pretty much any base gasket and any domes any carbs and any pipes and they run good. The twister cylinders don't necessisarly require more porting, but they do require a more precise install and setup criteria to be met to run good. There is some additional case porting that needs to be done with the twister cylinders than the cub cylinders, which requires epoxy. But the cylinders themselves come set up with pretty high port timings right from louie.

The twisters have a specific thickness base gasket, certain dome shapes, certain carb setups and are finiky with pipe designs. BUT, if you get them all set up right, the twister setup will scream. Plus, you will have a cylinder setup in the end that not everyone and their brother has.

The twister cylinders also have changeable exhaust flanges and different changeable intake sizes. The twister cylinders also have better head stud alignment and will handle the stresses and flex that happens in the head during the compression and firing phases.

I've got a 10mil big block twister (in my sig) and a buddy of mine has a 4mil small block twister. They are our favorite bikes out of all of them we have.

I'd go billet over cast any day of the week.

#9 96 sandshee

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Posted 14 February 2010 - 11:54 PM

I have a 7mil bottom end with the cases trenched and opened for 72-77mm pistons so I wanted to know which one is better?

In that case id go the billet twisters the super cubs are held back to much on intake side by only running stock size reed cages

#10 03portedshee

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 09:45 AM

Twister cylinder gets my vote. Everyone and their brother has a cub. Simple fact, as loco said, the cubs take a lot less knowledge and setup experience to make them run right. Pretty much any base gasket and any domes any carbs and any pipes and they run good. The twister cylinders don't necessisarly require more porting, but they do require a more precise install and setup criteria to be met to run good. There is some additional case porting that needs to be done with the twister cylinders than the cub cylinders, which requires epoxy. But the cylinders themselves come set up with pretty high port timings right from louie.

The twisters have a specific thickness base gasket, certain dome shapes, certain carb setups and are finiky with pipe designs. BUT, if you get them all set up right, the twister setup will scream. Plus, you will have a cylinder setup in the end that not everyone and their brother has.

The twister cylinders also have changeable exhaust flanges and different changeable intake sizes. The twister cylinders also have better head stud alignment and will handle the stresses and flex that happens in the head during the compression and firing phases.

I've got a 10mil big block twister (in my sig) and a buddy of mine has a 4mil small block twister. They are our favorite bikes out of all of them we have.

I'd go billet over cast any day of the week.

I would go with billet if you want to spend alot more money and time. You will find out that you will get no more HP out of the billet cylinder and prolly spend twice as much time and money on it. And by the way the only way the small intake affects a supercub is if you go over a 10 mm stroke and over 120 HP. Good luck with your choice.

#11 locogato11283

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 09:48 AM

i agree about staying away from the supercub motor unless the intake was set up for the bigger reeds.

in this scenario, i would go with a plain 7mm cub motor. it will be the cheapest, quickest turnaround on it.

im not against the twister cylinders at all but i think if i wanna gonna build one i would go bigger(than 7mm) once and be done with it. its obviously going to be the more expensive and time consuming build. if youre not worried about that, then go for it.. only problem i see is time of year right now. this is about the worst time of the year to start a motor build like that due to everyones riding seasons starting up in the next couple of months. if you wanna be riding quickly, go with the 7mm cub motor.

#12 batshee

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 11:43 AM

I say just keep ure vitos block and put that 7mill in it,stop trying to be sneaky... cuban boy still gonna take you lol padro

#13 Pedro

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 02:07 PM

I say just keep ure vitos block and put that 7mill in it,stop trying to be sneaky... cuban boy still gonna take you lol padro



I don't know there having trouble beating my stock stroke unported vito's setup that i am running right now. Lets see what happens when I build a 7mil....

#14 BigRed350x

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Posted 15 February 2010 - 08:52 PM

I would go with billet if you want to spend alot more money and time. You will find out that you will get no more HP out of the billet cylinder and prolly spend twice as much time and money on it. And by the way the only way the small intake affects a supercub is if you go over a 10 mm stroke and over 120 HP. Good luck with your choice.



Yep, the twister cylinders are more expensive. You get what you pay for. The craftsmanship and materials used in the twisters are second to none.

#15 03portedshee

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Posted 16 February 2010 - 08:20 AM

Yep, the twister cylinders are more expensive. You get what you pay for. The craftsmanship and materials used in the twisters are second to none.

Thats a 10 mill twister in your picture. What is that a 4 or 6 over swing arm? What kind of power do you make to need that long of a swing arm?